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CX2SA > SATDIG 15.03.18 12:47l 807 Lines 33965 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
BID : AMSATBB1398
Read: GUEST
Subj: AMSAT-BB-digest V13 98
Path: IW8PGT<CX2SA
Sent: 180315/1040Z @:CX2SA.SAL.URY.SOAM #:37824 [Salto] FBB7.00e $:AMSATBB1398
From: CX2SA@CX2SA.SAL.URY.SOAM
To : SATDIG@WW
Today's Topics:
1. Re: HDSDR and SDR Play2 (Richard Lawn)
2. Re: HDSDR and SDR Play2 (Robert Koepke)
3. Re: Greater Orbit, Larger Footprint: An Introduction to the
AMSAT GOLF Program (Jean Marc Momple)
4. Re: Help needed for automating Telemetry collect
(Jean Marc Momple)
5. Station and Operating Hints Web Page Updated (JoAnne K9JKM)
6. Re: Outernet L-Band now carries AMSAT and ARISS weekly
bulletins (Daniel Cussen)
7. Re: Outernet L-Band now carries AMSAT and ARISS weekly
bulletins (Stefan Wagener)
8. UKube-1 (Scott Harvey)
9. Re: UKube-1 (Joe N3XLS)
10. Re: Outernet L-Band now carries AMSAT and ARISS weekly
bulletins (Stephen Michael Kellat)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2018 11:17:23 -0400
From: Richard Lawn <rjlawn@?????.???>
To: Amsat BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] HDSDR and SDR Play2
Message-ID:
<CADQmrTFg8xGwf-LHggSY2+amX1ZVR+s3ERjhXQKK+YxgdjiHww@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
I went to that web page and while it looks like it is really worth trying,
even if you have a full duplex radio, I couldn't find a link to download
version 3 listed as the satellite version. What am I missing? At different
locations I have a 9100 and TS2000 but I'd like to get eyes on the downlink
as I had with my Flex radios.
73
Rick, W2JAZ
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2018 08:46:41 -0700
From: "Robert Koepke" <rkoepke@?????.??.???>
To: "'Richard Lawn'" <rjlawn@?????.???>, "'Amsat BB'"
<amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] HDSDR and SDR Play2
Message-ID: <02ed01d3bbab$a79025c0$f6b07140$@??.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Just under the "Welcome" on that SDR-Software link page is a link to Simon's
"SDR-Radio" web site at http://www.sdr-radio.com/. On the page that comes
up with that link is a "Software" drop-down that will take you to the
download links. Read the links on the pages that the drop down takes you to
- there are driver download links (gotta feed the dog) as well as the SDR
software downloads as you scroll further down.
Bob AA6TB
-----Original Message-----
From: AMSAT-BB [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@?????.???? On Behalf Of Richard Lawn
Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2018 8:17 AM
To: Amsat BB
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] HDSDR and SDR Play2
I went to that web page and while it looks like it is really worth trying,
even if you have a full duplex radio, I couldn't find a link to download
version 3 listed as the satellite version. What am I missing? At different
locations I have a 9100 and TS2000 but I'd like to get eyes on the downlink
as I had with my Flex radios.
73
Rick, W2JAZ
_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all
interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official
views of AMSAT-NA.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2018 20:15:56 +0400
From: Jean Marc Momple <jean.marc.momple@?????.???>
To: Paul Stoetzer <n8hm@????.???>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Greater Orbit, Larger Footprint: An
Introduction to the AMSAT GOLF Program
Message-ID: <911D31BA-E3BD-4E1F-95BB-B8EA0D265B50@?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Paul,
Thanks for the info.
This is good news for us this side of the World as most birds are not really
use due to small footprint.
I am active on most birds but only contact with ZS are regular, particularly
with my good friend Andre (ZS2BK), also made a few QSO?s with India and with
Thailand but most of the time I have the bird for myself and experimenting a
lot with power, telemetry etc? Therefore larger footprint will make more
QSO?s possible this side.
73
Jean Marc (3B8DU)
> On Mar 13, 2018, at 4:51 PM, Paul Stoetzer <n8hm@????.???> wrote:
>
> As a follow-up to the announcement that GOLF-TEE and GOLF-1 have been
> selected for launches through NASA's CubeSat Launch Initiative, we've
> posted an article introducing the GOLF program on the AMSAT website.
>
>
https://www.amsat.org/greater-orbit-larger-footprint-an-introduction-to-the-am
sat-golf-program/
>
> 73,
>
> Paul Stoetzer, N8HM
> Executive Vice President
> Radio Amateur Satellite Corporation (AMSAT-NA)
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2018 20:35:33 +0400
From: Jean Marc Momple <jean.marc.momple@?????.???>
To: Ryan Butler <rbutler@????.???>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Help needed for automating Telemetry collect
Message-ID: <CDC7B67D-E993-47E8-AA09-A19FB566BDE8@?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Ryan and all,
Thank to all of you who gave me hints and advices.
Finally I found a solution, HDSDR to explain:
1) With HDSDR one may set the output sampling rate and radio bandwidth.
unfortunately cannot switch off the de-emphasis on FM which would have been
then perfect for telemetry reception. The workaround is proper setting of
bandwidth and volume.
2) Made a few test today and all seems to work OK automatically for the
following birds, NOAA?s, AO-73, AO-85 (therefore all the Fox birds), CAS-4A
& 4B, therefore switching well automatically between the birds without any
OM intervention. Need to test more for other birds. The intention is to
have automated telemetry reporting for a maximum of Birds.
All these SDR software have their advantages or disadvantages in a
particular situation or hardware setup. I tested some of them such as
SDRSharp, SDRconsole, SDRuno and now HDSDR with both RTLSDR and SDRplay 2.
There is no magic tool but compromise for the application one want to
implement.
The BB is a nice tool to share experience and knowledge, thanks to the
organizers.
73
Jean Marc (3B8DU)
> On Mar 13, 2018, at 1:07 AM, Ryan Butler <rbutler@????.???> wrote:
>
> Jean Marc,
>
> I have the same issue with SDRConsole, I placed a message in the groups.io
<http://groups.io/> forum for SDRConsole asking for a way to modify whether
NFM or WFM is selected by CAT control, but the author has not responded to
it. It would be good if you could join that group and reply that it's a
problem for you as well so that possibly we'll get some more traction from
him.
>
> Ryan, NF0T
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2018 at 10:38 AM, Jean Marc Momple
<jean.marc.momple@?????.??? <mailto:jean.marc.momple@?????.???>> wrote:
> Dear All,
>
> I am trying to fully automate telemetry collect on many birds, my issue is
that I cannot get the SDR mode right, in a nutshell:
>
> 1) I use SATPC32 which fully control simultaneously the TS-2000x and
SDRconsole or SDRuno fine with a SDRplay RSP2 for frequency and doppler, the
rotors also no issue also. More SATPC32 automatically switches between
Satellites which is perfect.
> 2) I can decode most of the telemetries using softwares such as Foxtelem,
DK3WN and having different sound modems all in parallel, also no issue at all.
>
> My only issue is to have the SDR on the right mode particularly WFM for
most of the birds, as each time it goes to NFM which is not suitable.
>
> Has anyone tried same? If so what may be a possible solution to be able to
automate the station for automatic telemetry decoding?
>
> Thanks for any suggestion and help.
>
>
> 73
>
>
> Jean Marc (3B8DU)
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.??? <mailto:AMSAT-BB@?????.???>. AMSAT-NA makes
this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
<http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb>
>
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2018 11:40:55 -0500
From: "JoAnne K9JKM" <joanne.k9jkm@?????.???>
To: <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Station and Operating Hints Web Page Updated
Message-ID: <5aa95095.5b2e6b0a.d780b.b8f6@??.??????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
A PDF copy of the article, "Working the FalconSAT-3 Digipeater" by WD9EWK
has been added to the AMSAT Station and Operating Hints page:
https://www.amsat.org/station-and-operating-hints/
The new article is located on the page next to the other digipeater
articles. (scroll down)
--
73 de JoAnne K9JKM
k9jkm@?????.???
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2018 19:40:11 +0000
From: Daniel Cussen <dan@????.???>
To: amsat-bb@?????.???
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Outernet L-Band now carries AMSAT and ARISS
weekly bulletins
Message-ID:
<CAF3DnKidh8L=a4Pp3k-MhRLJP6kp3LacSPy+QAfVGXes_f=LzQ@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
I noticed another news story from Outernet and I have some comments.
For those who don't know Outernet is a "commercial" /for the greater
good, satellite downlink only service providing low bandwidth data,
aimed at filling and updating a hard drive with news and info, aimed
at developing nations, a free to receive data stream, for educational
purposes etc. Their latest stunt/change is to downlink on 12Ghz from a
Geostationary satellite, with reception without using a satellite
dish, but instead just a bare LNB pointed in the direction of the
geostationary satellite, using the gain of the horn inside the LNB.
News stories here:
https://hackaday.com/2018/02/22/at-71572-km-you-wont-beat-this-lora-record/
https://store.outernet.is/blogs/the-official-outernet-blog/world-record
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/lantern-a-global-satellite-data-radio
I would hesitate to recommend this system, as it is vapour-ware at the
moment, and all the previous kits/hardware released have been dropped
and made obsolete by changes to the broadcast. Previous broadcasts
were 12Ghz geostationary, but decoded using a DVB-S tuner demodulator,
then they changed to L-band low earth orbit immarsat and now they are
back on geostationary, this time with a new modulation scheme making
pointing easier. They are using the "LoRa" standard, basically just
using a protocol that allows low signal margin decoding ( Chirp Spread
Spectrum modulation (CSS) which trades data rate for sensitivity
within a fixed channel bandwidth. ), similar to WSJT/PSK31 and other
low data rate weak signal modes.
It is interesting they thing that a bare LNB (about 80 degree beam
width) that seems to be doing the trick, although they also show
pictures of patch antennas which presumably are designed for narrower
beam width more suited to this.
The main caution I would have is they seem to be constantly peddling
hardware, which soon becomes obsolete, without in fact any real
business model to fund the venture. They claim their business model
will be advertising or donations, obtained after the system catches
on, on a large scale, but I have not seen any real attempt to get wide
scale adoption in poor regions. They either do not have the funds or
cannot get critical adoption for this one-way solution. Anyway I would
encourage Amateurs to look at the "technology demonstration" they have
made and consider if similar techniques could be applied to LEO or
Geostationary Amateur or Emergency uses. Assuming they are still
relaying the weekly AMSAT news (I have not seen any actual listing of
what is actually downlinked, except for vague references to tests and
some of Wikipedia) it might be a good fun project, but beware the
technology is very untested and if (or when) they go bust, then the
signals will stop. I have to wonder if the L-band service was a short
term contract, that they can no longer pay for, and that they have
fallen back to cheaper geostationary data.
If someone could set up a receiver (when they actually re-launch/start
a new service) and list what is actually down linked, that would be
good to know, but for now I would consider it still very much in the
testing phase.
I would have thought if they were serious they would have launched a
finished tested solution by now, aimed at developing nations and have
it backed by advertising to make broadcasting self funding.
Dan EI9FHB
On 24/10/2016, Robert Bruninga <bruninga@????.???> wrote:
> The Outernet L-band feed is now carrying a condensed version of the AMSAT
> and ARISS weekly news files. (Global Geosat coverage except for Northern
> Alaska)...
>
> Receivers are simple: http://aprs.org/outnet.html
>
> For ARISS, I manually added a 2 char grid square to each school listed in
> the school schedule and am asking the outernet folks to parse out that
> location info and plot a 1200 km footprint on their weather globe showing
> where people can tune in the ARISS contacts. Then their RTL-SDR dongle
> could then actually be retuned to hear the contact. Just an idea...
>
> Bob, WB4APR
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: AMSAT-BB [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@?????.???? On Behalf Of Dani
> EA4GPZ
> Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2016 7:36 AM
> To: amsat-bb@?????.???
> Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] New Outernet L-Band service...
>
>>> I hope someday a service like this will be available
>>> from an AMSAT geostationary service.
>
>> I'm pretty confident that the guys at AMSAT-DL are capable
>> of doing this much better on the upcoming EsHail'2
>> than what Outernet is currently doing on Inmarsat...
>
>> They already have in mind a "DVB-S beacon"... broadcast
>> from the ground station at Qatar ... carrying videos
>> about Ham radio and Ham radio events on this signal.
>
>> What is more, if you have equipment to operate EsHail'2 on SSB,
>> it's more or less easy to use either the narrowband transponder
>> or the wideband transponder to transmit an Outernet-type signal
>> through EsHail'2, so anyone can have a go with this.
>
>> Outernet uses 4200baud BPSK and half of the bitrate is spent for FEC.
>> You can use a bit less bitrate to get a signal that will even pass
>> through a conventional 2.7kHz SSB filter and you can use less
>> bits for FEC to get increased data throughput (but more SNR required).
>
>> Dani EA4GPZ.
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
> expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2018 21:34:36 +0100
From: Stefan Wagener <wageners@?????.???>
To: Daniel Cussen <dan@????.???>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Outernet L-Band now carries AMSAT and ARISS
weekly bulletins
Message-ID:
<CAKu8kHDsDSmCPqUd=Rye1Yf5WGStONtSRsWLyPeNH9FxH7W9cg@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Sorry Daniel,
I believe you are missing the point. First of all, Outernet is a very
interesting platform to experiment and their very inexpensive patch
antenna, SDR based approach and software has already met lots of
expectations. There is absolutely nothing wrong with changing hardware and
no it is NOT obsolete! I still use my "old" Outernet antenna, sdr receiver
for experimentation and yes, I am looking forward to their next steps.
After all, its a hobby for us!
73, Stefan VE4NSA
On Wed, Mar 14, 2018 at 8:40 PM, Daniel Cussen <dan@????.???> wrote:
> I noticed another news story from Outernet and I have some comments.
>
> For those who don't know Outernet is a "commercial" /for the greater
> good, satellite downlink only service providing low bandwidth data,
> aimed at filling and updating a hard drive with news and info, aimed
> at developing nations, a free to receive data stream, for educational
> purposes etc. Their latest stunt/change is to downlink on 12Ghz from a
> Geostationary satellite, with reception without using a satellite
> dish, but instead just a bare LNB pointed in the direction of the
> geostationary satellite, using the gain of the horn inside the LNB.
>
> News stories here:
> https://hackaday.com/2018/02/22/at-71572-km-you-wont-beat-
> this-lora-record/
>
> https://store.outernet.is/blogs/the-official-outernet-blog/world-record
>
> https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/lantern-a-global-satellite-data-radio
>
> I would hesitate to recommend this system, as it is vapour-ware at the
> moment, and all the previous kits/hardware released have been dropped
> and made obsolete by changes to the broadcast. Previous broadcasts
> were 12Ghz geostationary, but decoded using a DVB-S tuner demodulator,
> then they changed to L-band low earth orbit immarsat and now they are
> back on geostationary, this time with a new modulation scheme making
> pointing easier. They are using the "LoRa" standard, basically just
> using a protocol that allows low signal margin decoding ( Chirp Spread
> Spectrum modulation (CSS) which trades data rate for sensitivity
> within a fixed channel bandwidth. ), similar to WSJT/PSK31 and other
> low data rate weak signal modes.
>
> It is interesting they thing that a bare LNB (about 80 degree beam
> width) that seems to be doing the trick, although they also show
> pictures of patch antennas which presumably are designed for narrower
> beam width more suited to this.
>
> The main caution I would have is they seem to be constantly peddling
> hardware, which soon becomes obsolete, without in fact any real
> business model to fund the venture. They claim their business model
> will be advertising or donations, obtained after the system catches
> on, on a large scale, but I have not seen any real attempt to get wide
> scale adoption in poor regions. They either do not have the funds or
> cannot get critical adoption for this one-way solution. Anyway I would
> encourage Amateurs to look at the "technology demonstration" they have
> made and consider if similar techniques could be applied to LEO or
> Geostationary Amateur or Emergency uses. Assuming they are still
> relaying the weekly AMSAT news (I have not seen any actual listing of
> what is actually downlinked, except for vague references to tests and
> some of Wikipedia) it might be a good fun project, but beware the
> technology is very untested and if (or when) they go bust, then the
> signals will stop. I have to wonder if the L-band service was a short
> term contract, that they can no longer pay for, and that they have
> fallen back to cheaper geostationary data.
>
> If someone could set up a receiver (when they actually re-launch/start
> a new service) and list what is actually down linked, that would be
> good to know, but for now I would consider it still very much in the
> testing phase.
>
> I would have thought if they were serious they would have launched a
> finished tested solution by now, aimed at developing nations and have
> it backed by advertising to make broadcasting self funding.
>
> Dan EI9FHB
>
>
> On 24/10/2016, Robert Bruninga <bruninga@????.???> wrote:
> > The Outernet L-band feed is now carrying a condensed version of the AMSAT
> > and ARISS weekly news files. (Global Geosat coverage except for Northern
> > Alaska)...
> >
> > Receivers are simple: http://aprs.org/outnet.html
> >
> > For ARISS, I manually added a 2 char grid square to each school listed in
> > the school schedule and am asking the outernet folks to parse out that
> > location info and plot a 1200 km footprint on their weather globe showing
> > where people can tune in the ARISS contacts. Then their RTL-SDR dongle
> > could then actually be retuned to hear the contact. Just an idea...
> >
> > Bob, WB4APR
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: AMSAT-BB [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@?????.???? On Behalf Of Dani
> > EA4GPZ
> > Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2016 7:36 AM
> > To: amsat-bb@?????.???
> > Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] New Outernet L-Band service...
> >
> >>> I hope someday a service like this will be available
> >>> from an AMSAT geostationary service.
> >
> >> I'm pretty confident that the guys at AMSAT-DL are capable
> >> of doing this much better on the upcoming EsHail'2
> >> than what Outernet is currently doing on Inmarsat...
> >
> >> They already have in mind a "DVB-S beacon"... broadcast
> >> from the ground station at Qatar ... carrying videos
> >> about Ham radio and Ham radio events on this signal.
> >
> >> What is more, if you have equipment to operate EsHail'2 on SSB,
> >> it's more or less easy to use either the narrowband transponder
> >> or the wideband transponder to transmit an Outernet-type signal
> >> through EsHail'2, so anyone can have a go with this.
> >
> >> Outernet uses 4200baud BPSK and half of the bitrate is spent for FEC.
> >> You can use a bit less bitrate to get a signal that will even pass
> >> through a conventional 2.7kHz SSB filter and you can use less
> >> bits for FEC to get increased data throughput (but more SNR required).
> >
> >> Dani EA4GPZ.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> Opinions
> > expressed
> > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> > AMSAT-NA.
> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> program!
> > Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
> expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2018 23:27:35 +0000 (UTC)
From: Scott Harvey <ka7fvv@?????.???>
To: amsat-bb@?????.???
Subject: [amsat-bb] UKube-1
Message-ID: <2107342718.765625.1521070055072@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
I think UKube-1 is like the forgotten step child.? Found it active this
afternoon on a great descending pass down the west coast and no one on but
myself to talk to.? Thought it was down but transmitted up like you have to
do on Funcube-1 one and found my downlink.? It is alive and well.
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2018 19:44:00 -0400
From: Joe N3XLS <n3xls@?????.???>
To: amsat-bb@?????.???
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] UKube-1
Message-ID: <20180314234409.15AF08D98@??????????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
I was almost all alone on XW-2B and XW-2F this evening. WO3T joined me.
Seems to be the norm on weekday passes. Over the weekend cas4b was booming.??
The FM sat are normally busy regardless.?
-------- Original message --------From: Scott Harvey via AMSAT-BB
<amsat-bb@?????.???> Date: 3/14/18 7:27 PM (GMT-05:00) To:
amsat-bb@?????.??? Subject: [amsat-bb] UKube-1
I think UKube-1 is like the forgotten step child.? Found it active this
afternoon on a great descending pass down the west coast and no one on but
myself to talk to.? Thought it was down but transmitted up like you have to
do on Funcube-1 one and found my downlink.? It is alive and well.
_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed
are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2018 05:32:56 -0400
From: Stephen Michael Kellat <smkellat@??????.???>
To: amsat-bb@?????.???
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Outernet L-Band now carries AMSAT and ARISS
weekly bulletins
Message-ID: <0D267F56-C9D0-41AF-85FC-6AC2312C3489@??????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Outernet just seems to be lacking in purpose. Experimentation is great.
This group has spent quite a bit of money on leased transponder time and
just burned through it. Frankly I haven't been impressed with them. I
would be far more likely to support AMSAT financially first in the future
rather than some software developers who think that because they understand
some bits of software development they therefore understand the world.
"Shifting Paradigms Without a Clutch" is the bumper sticker history of the
project so far as I've observed.
Stephen Michael Kellat
KC8BFI
On Wed, Mar 14, 2018 at 09:34:36PM +0100, Stefan Wagener wrote:
> Sorry Daniel,
>
> I believe you are missing the point. First of all, Outernet is a very
> interesting platform to experiment and their very inexpensive patch
> antenna, SDR based approach and software has already met lots of
> expectations. There is absolutely nothing wrong with changing hardware and
> no it is NOT obsolete! I still use my "old" Outernet antenna, sdr receiver
> for experimentation and yes, I am looking forward to their next steps.
> After all, its a hobby for us!
>
> 73, Stefan VE4NSA
>
> On Wed, Mar 14, 2018 at 8:40 PM, Daniel Cussen <dan@????.???> wrote:
>
> > I noticed another news story from Outernet and I have some comments.
> >
> > For those who don't know Outernet is a "commercial" /for the greater
> > good, satellite downlink only service providing low bandwidth data,
> > aimed at filling and updating a hard drive with news and info, aimed
> > at developing nations, a free to receive data stream, for educational
> > purposes etc. Their latest stunt/change is to downlink on 12Ghz from a
> > Geostationary satellite, with reception without using a satellite
> > dish, but instead just a bare LNB pointed in the direction of the
> > geostationary satellite, using the gain of the horn inside the LNB.
> >
> > News stories here:
> > https://hackaday.com/2018/02/22/at-71572-km-you-wont-beat-
> > this-lora-record/
> >
> > https://store.outernet.is/blogs/the-official-outernet-blog/world-record
> >
> > https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/lantern-a-global-satellite-data-radio
> >
> > I would hesitate to recommend this system, as it is vapour-ware at the
> > moment, and all the previous kits/hardware released have been dropped
> > and made obsolete by changes to the broadcast. Previous broadcasts
> > were 12Ghz geostationary, but decoded using a DVB-S tuner demodulator,
> > then they changed to L-band low earth orbit immarsat and now they are
> > back on geostationary, this time with a new modulation scheme making
> > pointing easier. They are using the "LoRa" standard, basically just
> > using a protocol that allows low signal margin decoding ( Chirp Spread
> > Spectrum modulation (CSS) which trades data rate for sensitivity
> > within a fixed channel bandwidth. ), similar to WSJT/PSK31 and other
> > low data rate weak signal modes.
> >
> > It is interesting they thing that a bare LNB (about 80 degree beam
> > width) that seems to be doing the trick, although they also show
> > pictures of patch antennas which presumably are designed for narrower
> > beam width more suited to this.
> >
> > The main caution I would have is they seem to be constantly peddling
> > hardware, which soon becomes obsolete, without in fact any real
> > business model to fund the venture. They claim their business model
> > will be advertising or donations, obtained after the system catches
> > on, on a large scale, but I have not seen any real attempt to get wide
> > scale adoption in poor regions. They either do not have the funds or
> > cannot get critical adoption for this one-way solution. Anyway I would
> > encourage Amateurs to look at the "technology demonstration" they have
> > made and consider if similar techniques could be applied to LEO or
> > Geostationary Amateur or Emergency uses. Assuming they are still
> > relaying the weekly AMSAT news (I have not seen any actual listing of
> > what is actually downlinked, except for vague references to tests and
> > some of Wikipedia) it might be a good fun project, but beware the
> > technology is very untested and if (or when) they go bust, then the
> > signals will stop. I have to wonder if the L-band service was a short
> > term contract, that they can no longer pay for, and that they have
> > fallen back to cheaper geostationary data.
> >
> > If someone could set up a receiver (when they actually re-launch/start
> > a new service) and list what is actually down linked, that would be
> > good to know, but for now I would consider it still very much in the
> > testing phase.
> >
> > I would have thought if they were serious they would have launched a
> > finished tested solution by now, aimed at developing nations and have
> > it backed by advertising to make broadcasting self funding.
> >
> > Dan EI9FHB
> >
> >
> > On 24/10/2016, Robert Bruninga <bruninga@????.???> wrote:
> > > The Outernet L-band feed is now carrying a condensed version of the
AMSAT
> > > and ARISS weekly news files. (Global Geosat coverage except for
Northern
> > > Alaska)...
> > >
> > > Receivers are simple: http://aprs.org/outnet.html
> > >
> > > For ARISS, I manually added a 2 char grid square to each school listed
in
> > > the school schedule and am asking the outernet folks to parse out that
> > > location info and plot a 1200 km footprint on their weather globe
showing
> > > where people can tune in the ARISS contacts. Then their RTL-SDR dongle
> > > could then actually be retuned to hear the contact. Just an idea...
> > >
> > > Bob, WB4APR
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: AMSAT-BB [mailto:amsat-bb-bounces@?????.???? On Behalf Of Dani
> > > EA4GPZ
> > > Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2016 7:36 AM
> > > To: amsat-bb@?????.???
> > > Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] New Outernet L-Band service...
> > >
> > >>> I hope someday a service like this will be available
> > >>> from an AMSAT geostationary service.
> > >
> > >> I'm pretty confident that the guys at AMSAT-DL are capable
> > >> of doing this much better on the upcoming EsHail'2
> > >> than what Outernet is currently doing on Inmarsat...
> > >
> > >> They already have in mind a "DVB-S beacon"... broadcast
> > >> from the ground station at Qatar ... carrying videos
> > >> about Ham radio and Ham radio events on this signal.
> > >
> > >> What is more, if you have equipment to operate EsHail'2 on SSB,
> > >> it's more or less easy to use either the narrowband transponder
> > >> or the wideband transponder to transmit an Outernet-type signal
> > >> through EsHail'2, so anyone can have a go with this.
> > >
> > >> Outernet uses 4200baud BPSK and half of the bitrate is spent for FEC.
> > >> You can use a bit less bitrate to get a signal that will even pass
> > >> through a conventional 2.7kHz SSB filter and you can use less
> > >> bits for FEC to get increased data throughput (but more SNR required).
> > >
> > >> Dani EA4GPZ.
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> > > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> > Opinions
> > > expressed
> > > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> > > AMSAT-NA.
> > > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> > program!
> > > Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
> > expressed
> > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> > AMSAT-NA.
> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
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> >
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Subject: Digest Footer
_______________________________________________
Sent via amsat-bb@?????.???.
AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide
without requiring membership. Opinions expressed
are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
Not an AMSAT member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
http://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
End of AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 13, Issue 98
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