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CX2SA > SATDIG 20.03.20 00:01l 1093 Lines 40002 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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From: CX2SA@CX2SA.SAL.URY.SOAM
To : SATDIG@WW
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Poor Operators (Mike Wilhelm)
2. Re: Poor Operators (Mike Wilhelm)
3. QRP Days for FM Birds? (Hasan al-Basri)
4. Re: Poor Operators (Matthew Chambers)
5. Re: Poor Operators (Matthew Chambers)
6. Re: Poor Operators (KI7UNJ Tucker)
7. Re: QRP Days for FM Birds? (Matthew Chambers)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 15:07:22 -0500
From: Mike Wilhelm <af5at.radio@?????.???>
To: Isaac C <shorenicehere@?????.???>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Poor Operators
Message-ID:
<CABQUVrXAwMVSR-SuF-yeU9BsOtFKMFKXyAmrYGyGE3L_p3q3UQ@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Thanks Glenn, Isaac ! I appreciate the help.
On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 1:52 PM Isaac C <shorenicehere@?????.???> wrote:
> Mike,
> I am Isaac, W4ITC, grid FM14.
> I am maybe two weeks ahead of you in the newbie category. I just got my
> first QSO/QSL on March 12.
> I connected with W0NBC.
> After me, you can hear WB3CSY do an expert connection with someone else.
> I listened to many passed before I was brave enough to talk. It probably
> shows.
> My rig is qty 2 Baofengs @ 5w with a WA5VJB home-made antenna.
>
> Best luck.
>
>
>
https://drive.google.com/file/d/14YSF3hL6NBtRMkcw3gDcx8VURQ3dBUNl/view?usp=dri
vesdk
>
>
> On Thursday, March 19, 2020, Mike Wilhelm via AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
> wrote:
>
>> I've been collecting equipment and waiting for the right time to try and
>> get on a bird. Life is too busy...
>> Anyway, it might be helpful if there were a few audio examples we could
>> pass on to newbies and uninformed operators of good and bad operating. I
>> would recommend beeping out any parts of the call sign for any examples of
>> poor operation. I'd sure like to hear them. Maybe even post them to a
>> section on the AMSAT page covering operating? I apologize if this is
>> already out there...back to that too busy thing again. I haven't had many
>> opportunities to take my FT-470 outside with my Arrow and chase a bird.
>> The QSOs I've heard seem like they go so fast and I'd hate to annoy anyone
>> by being the slowpoke.
>> 73! Mike AF5AT
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 12:52 PM Brad Smith via AMSAT-BB <
>> amsat-bb@?????.???>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > I am a minimalist because I want to be a minimalist. I understand that
>> the
>> > FM bird is nothing more than a repeater and the strongest signal takes
>> the
>> > bird, even if someone else is talking. "Someone else is talking" is the
>> > rude part. Last weekend, I was chasing a rover and got "KC9" out and
>> into
>> > the bird (I work full duplux, so know that I was in) and someone took
>> over
>> > by stepping on me. Luckily, I got him anyway, but someone was high power
>> > and more important than me. That's the way contesters work. But, I don't
>> > want to plaster someone's call on the board. I just hope that the
>> person is
>> > a member and thinks about it. Getting into a peeing contest with
>> someone is
>> > not beneficial to anybody, including the hobby. It used to be that if
>> one
>> > said "handheld" or "portable" guys would give them a break, but that
>> > doesn't happen anymore. The birds are too crowded for that. There are
>> > several people in my ham clubs that want to try satellite operation and
>> > myself and my friend Rick (WA9JBQ) loves to
>> > mentor them and teach them the proper way to operate. Not everyone has
>> > this benefit. I don't know what the answer is. Last Spring one ham was
>> an
>> > extremely poor operator on the birds, but is now a better operator. So,
>> > something works. But there is always the tendency to crank up the power
>> to
>> > get the station that you want, if you have the power available. It is
>> like
>> > guys who I know that run 1,500 watts on FT8 to get what they want. I
>> guess
>> > it is going to happen and we have to live with that fact.
>> >
>> > As soon as I solve my equipment problem with my 847 and the weather
>> turns
>> > warmer, I will be back on the linear birds. I sure do miss FO-29. Brad
>> > KC9UQR
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
>> > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
>> Opinions
>> > expressed
>> > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
>> > AMSAT-NA.
>> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>> program!
>> > Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
>> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
>> Opinions expressed
>> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
>> AMSAT-NA.
>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
>> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>
>
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 15:09:40 -0500
From: Mike Wilhelm <af5at.radio@?????.???>
To: Mike Wilhelm <af5at.radio@?????.???>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Poor Operators
Message-ID:
<CABQUVrVmfcyw5ejXf6bVxhQJ7e31ec3GwZEf9ZvvotHk01NVXg@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Sorry I missed a lot of your replies. Many thanks to all !
On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 3:07 PM Mike Wilhelm <af5at.radio@?????.???> wrote:
> Thanks Glenn, Isaac ! I appreciate the help.
>
> On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 1:52 PM Isaac C <shorenicehere@?????.???> wrote:
>
>> Mike,
>> I am Isaac, W4ITC, grid FM14.
>> I am maybe two weeks ahead of you in the newbie category. I just got my
>> first QSO/QSL on March 12.
>> I connected with W0NBC.
>> After me, you can hear WB3CSY do an expert connection with someone else.
>> I listened to many passed before I was brave enough to talk. It probably
>> shows.
>> My rig is qty 2 Baofengs @ 5w with a WA5VJB home-made antenna.
>>
>> Best luck.
>>
>>
>>
https://drive.google.com/file/d/14YSF3hL6NBtRMkcw3gDcx8VURQ3dBUNl/view?usp=dri
vesdk
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, March 19, 2020, Mike Wilhelm via AMSAT-BB <
>> amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
>>
>>> I've been collecting equipment and waiting for the right time to try and
>>> get on a bird. Life is too busy...
>>> Anyway, it might be helpful if there were a few audio examples we could
>>> pass on to newbies and uninformed operators of good and bad operating. I
>>> would recommend beeping out any parts of the call sign for any examples
>>> of
>>> poor operation. I'd sure like to hear them. Maybe even post them to a
>>> section on the AMSAT page covering operating? I apologize if this is
>>> already out there...back to that too busy thing again. I haven't had
>>> many
>>> opportunities to take my FT-470 outside with my Arrow and chase a bird.
>>> The QSOs I've heard seem like they go so fast and I'd hate to annoy
>>> anyone
>>> by being the slowpoke.
>>> 73! Mike AF5AT
>>>
>>> On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 12:52 PM Brad Smith via AMSAT-BB <
>>> amsat-bb@?????.???>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> > I am a minimalist because I want to be a minimalist. I understand that
>>> the
>>> > FM bird is nothing more than a repeater and the strongest signal takes
>>> the
>>> > bird, even if someone else is talking. "Someone else is talking" is the
>>> > rude part. Last weekend, I was chasing a rover and got "KC9" out and
>>> into
>>> > the bird (I work full duplux, so know that I was in) and someone took
>>> over
>>> > by stepping on me. Luckily, I got him anyway, but someone was high
>>> power
>>> > and more important than me. That's the way contesters work. But, I
>>> don't
>>> > want to plaster someone's call on the board. I just hope that the
>>> person is
>>> > a member and thinks about it. Getting into a peeing contest with
>>> someone is
>>> > not beneficial to anybody, including the hobby. It used to be that if
>>> one
>>> > said "handheld" or "portable" guys would give them a break, but that
>>> > doesn't happen anymore. The birds are too crowded for that. There are
>>> > several people in my ham clubs that want to try satellite operation and
>>> > myself and my friend Rick (WA9JBQ) loves to
>>> > mentor them and teach them the proper way to operate. Not everyone has
>>> > this benefit. I don't know what the answer is. Last Spring one ham was
>>> an
>>> > extremely poor operator on the birds, but is now a better operator. So,
>>> > something works. But there is always the tendency to crank up the
>>> power to
>>> > get the station that you want, if you have the power available. It is
>>> like
>>> > guys who I know that run 1,500 watts on FT8 to get what they want. I
>>> guess
>>> > it is going to happen and we have to live with that fact.
>>> >
>>> > As soon as I solve my equipment problem with my 847 and the weather
>>> turns
>>> > warmer, I will be back on the linear birds. I sure do miss FO-29. Brad
>>> > KC9UQR
>>> > _______________________________________________
>>> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
>>> > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
>>> Opinions
>>> > expressed
>>> > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views
>>> of
>>> > AMSAT-NA.
>>> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>> program!
>>> > Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>> >
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
>>> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
>>> Opinions expressed
>>> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
>>> AMSAT-NA.
>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
>>> program!
>>> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>
>>
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 15:32:45 -0500
From: Hasan al-Basri <hbasri.schiers6@?????.???>
To: AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: [amsat-bb] QRP Days for FM Birds?
Message-ID:
<CAM4UQf0eJ847dz1xWfXNgELR9OCBCG+dZy9CWW2tJtZ+QNBOSA@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Why Not?
I remember in "the old days" of Sat ops we used to have exactly that. A 24
hour period where EIRP was limited.
It was once a week on the same day. It started UTC 0000 and ran for 24
hours. Then the normal free-for-all resumed. People, in those days, had
enough self-respect and restraint to actually observe the QRP Day.
It was the "honor" system. But it did allow a lot of marginally equipped
stations to make a lot of satellite qsos. Even as recently as two years
ago, I can remember standing next to my EggBeaters (7' off the ground),
with a piece of coax going from my 5W H/T to the duplexer and up to the
eggbeaters. I was able to make a qso then. Now, in most cases, it would be
futile.
I don't know if something like this could be organized for the FM birds,
but if so, *it would need backing and publicizing by AMSAT*.
It would be wonderful to hear people easily using the bird for even a few
hours running nothing but an HT at 2.5 watts output and a hand held Arrow
(or the equivalent of that say 10 watts to a simple 1/4w vertical)
If we assume the handheld yagis have 10 dBi gain on 70cm, then the EIRP
would be 25 watts.
For home stations, the same idea. No more than 25 watts Effective Radiated
Power (RF Output + Antenna Gain - Feedline Loss)
A simple 1/4 wave vertical might be 2 dBi, so 10w would be in the ballpark.
The goal would be to keep uplink power limited to 25 watts effective
radiated power.
QRP day could be a celebration of sorts, if it became popular ...there
would be a sort of peer prestige thing take place, as opposed to worshiping
the mighty grid.
A grass roots approach won't work. It has to be led by people with some
standing and credibility, and for AO-91 and AO-92 it would have to be
AMSAT. It would require some real effort on their part, not just a by-line
in the weekly news.
Once it took hold, some self policing could probably keep it going.
Just and idea for the FM birds. It might be fun. It might give more rovers
and portable Ops a chance.
The linear birds don't need it, as the strength of the user downlink signal
is to be kept to no stronger than the CW beacon and we can easily identify
the offenders.
73, N0AN
Hasan
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 14:50:40 -0500
From: Matthew Chambers <mchambers@?????????.????>
To: "amsat-bb@?????.???? <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Poor Operators
Message-ID:
<CA+0ZtTYattBMOXbzmL5JdJnrFWgdj+E7Kc78+6yFbg5fBDM_Qg@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
This is not just a problem for hams on satellites but hams on local
repeaters passing emergency traffic and unfortunately also an infested
problem in my 911 dispatch. I wish I knew how to slow people down. I tell
people to listen to the Missouri Highway Patrol dispatch and try to sound
like them, it sometimes works, usually not as well as i'd like.
Matthew Chambers, CBT, NR0Q
Owner/Engineer
*M Chambers Communications Engineering LLC*
PO BOX 855, Moberly, MO 65270
Mobile (660)415-5620
www.mchambersradio.com
On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 2:43 PM John Kludt via AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
wrote:
> All,
>
> There is another practice that I have not seen addressed here that makes
> thing really tough - talking way too fast. I understand the reason but
> fast talking just leads to the request for repeats which means more traffic
> and/or busted Q's. So in addition to turn down the power how about
> talking just a little slowly and more clearly?
>
> Just a suggestion.
>
> John K4SQC
>
> On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 3:03 PM Isaac C via AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
> wrote:
>
> > ps -. it was SO-50, pass 11:58 local time, Mar 12.
> >
> > On Thursday, March 19, 2020, Isaac C <shorenicehere@?????.???> wrote:
> >
> > > Mike,
> > > I am Isaac, W4ITC, grid FM14.
> > > I am maybe two weeks ahead of you in the newbie category. I just got my
> > > first QSO/QSL on March 12.
> > > I connected with W0NBC.
> > > After me, you can hear WB3CSY do an expert connection with someone
> else.
> > > I listened to many passed before I was brave enough to talk. It
> probably
> > > shows.
> > > My rig is qty 2 Baofengs @ 5w with a WA5VJB home-made antenna.
> > >
> > > Best luck.
> > >
> > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/14YSF3hL6NBtRMkcw3gDcx8VURQ3dB
> > > UNl/view?usp=drivesdk
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thursday, March 19, 2020, Mike Wilhelm via AMSAT-BB <
> > amsat-bb@?????.???>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >> I've been collecting equipment and waiting for the right time to try
> and
> > >> get on a bird. Life is too busy...
> > >> Anyway, it might be helpful if there were a few audio examples we
> could
> > >> pass on to newbies and uninformed operators of good and bad operating.
> > I
> > >> would recommend beeping out any parts of the call sign for any
> examples
> > of
> > >> poor operation. I'd sure like to hear them. Maybe even post them to
> a
> > >> section on the AMSAT page covering operating? I apologize if this is
> > >> already out there...back to that too busy thing again. I haven't had
> > many
> > >> opportunities to take my FT-470 outside with my Arrow and chase a
> bird.
> > >> The QSOs I've heard seem like they go so fast and I'd hate to annoy
> > anyone
> > >> by being the slowpoke.
> > >> 73! Mike AF5AT
> > >>
> > >> On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 12:52 PM Brad Smith via AMSAT-BB <
> > >> amsat-bb@?????.???>
> > >> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > I am a minimalist because I want to be a minimalist. I understand
> that
> > >> the
> > >> > FM bird is nothing more than a repeater and the strongest signal
> takes
> > >> the
> > >> > bird, even if someone else is talking. "Someone else is talking" is
> > the
> > >> > rude part. Last weekend, I was chasing a rover and got "KC9" out and
> > >> into
> > >> > the bird (I work full duplux, so know that I was in) and someone
> took
> > >> over
> > >> > by stepping on me. Luckily, I got him anyway, but someone was high
> > power
> > >> > and more important than me. That's the way contesters work. But, I
> > don't
> > >> > want to plaster someone's call on the board. I just hope that the
> > >> person is
> > >> > a member and thinks about it. Getting into a peeing contest with
> > >> someone is
> > >> > not beneficial to anybody, including the hobby. It used to be that
> if
> > >> one
> > >> > said "handheld" or "portable" guys would give them a break, but that
> > >> > doesn't happen anymore. The birds are too crowded for that. There
> are
> > >> > several people in my ham clubs that want to try satellite operation
> > and
> > >> > myself and my friend Rick (WA9JBQ) loves to
> > >> > mentor them and teach them the proper way to operate. Not everyone
> > has
> > >> > this benefit. I don't know what the answer is. Last Spring one ham
> was
> > >> an
> > >> > extremely poor operator on the birds, but is now a better operator.
> > So,
> > >> > something works. But there is always the tendency to crank up the
> > power
> > >> to
> > >> > get the station that you want, if you have the power available. It
> is
> > >> like
> > >> > guys who I know that run 1,500 watts on FT8 to get what they want. I
> > >> guess
> > >> > it is going to happen and we have to live with that fact.
> > >> >
> > >> > As soon as I solve my equipment problem with my 847 and the weather
> > >> turns
> > >> > warmer, I will be back on the linear birds. I sure do miss FO-29.
> Brad
> > >> > KC9UQR
> > >> > _______________________________________________
> > >> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum
> available
> > >> > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> > >> Opinions
> > >> > expressed
> > >> > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official
> views
> > of
> > >> > AMSAT-NA.
> > >> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> > >> program!
> > >> > Subscription settings:
> > https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> > >> >
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> > >> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> > >> Opinions expressed
> > >> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views
> of
> > >> AMSAT-NA.
> > >> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> > program!
> > >> Subscription settings:
> https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> > >>
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> Opinions
> > expressed
> > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> > AMSAT-NA.
> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> program!
> > Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
> expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 15:00:57 -0500
From: Matthew Chambers <mchambers@?????????.????>
To: "amsat-bb@?????.???? <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Poor Operators
Message-ID:
<CA+0ZtTa=soEEm-xgxDiVuQogqKGtUM_2+gsLwRvQjLr=FG=45g@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
And using standardized phonetics is even better, I hear on HF all the time
calls that sound like "Zanzibar Portugal Derkaderkastan"
Matthew Chambers, CBT, NR0Q
Owner/Engineer
*M Chambers Communications Engineering LLC*
PO BOX 855, Moberly, MO 65270
Mobile (660)415-5620
www.mchambersradio.com
On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 2:56 PM John Geiger via AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
wrote:
> Using phonetics can really help also, especially if you have letters that
> sound alike in your call, such as T and D.
>
> 73 John W5TD
>
> On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 2:40 PM John Kludt via AMSAT-BB <
> amsat-bb@?????.???>
> wrote:
>
> > All,
> >
> > There is another practice that I have not seen addressed here that makes
> > thing really tough - talking way too fast. I understand the reason but
> > fast talking just leads to the request for repeats which means more
> traffic
> > and/or busted Q's. So in addition to turn down the power how about
> > talking just a little slowly and more clearly?
> >
> > Just a suggestion.
> >
> > John K4SQC
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 3:03 PM Isaac C via AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???
> >
> > wrote:
> >
> > > ps -. it was SO-50, pass 11:58 local time, Mar 12.
> > >
> > > On Thursday, March 19, 2020, Isaac C <shorenicehere@?????.???> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Mike,
> > > > I am Isaac, W4ITC, grid FM14.
> > > > I am maybe two weeks ahead of you in the newbie category. I just got
> my
> > > > first QSO/QSL on March 12.
> > > > I connected with W0NBC.
> > > > After me, you can hear WB3CSY do an expert connection with someone
> > else.
> > > > I listened to many passed before I was brave enough to talk. It
> > probably
> > > > shows.
> > > > My rig is qty 2 Baofengs @ 5w with a WA5VJB home-made antenna.
> > > >
> > > > Best luck.
> > > >
> > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/14YSF3hL6NBtRMkcw3gDcx8VURQ3dB
> > > > UNl/view?usp=drivesdk
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Thursday, March 19, 2020, Mike Wilhelm via AMSAT-BB <
> > > amsat-bb@?????.???>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> I've been collecting equipment and waiting for the right time to try
> > and
> > > >> get on a bird. Life is too busy...
> > > >> Anyway, it might be helpful if there were a few audio examples we
> > could
> > > >> pass on to newbies and uninformed operators of good and bad
> operating.
> > > I
> > > >> would recommend beeping out any parts of the call sign for any
> > examples
> > > of
> > > >> poor operation. I'd sure like to hear them. Maybe even post them
> to
> > a
> > > >> section on the AMSAT page covering operating? I apologize if this
> is
> > > >> already out there...back to that too busy thing again. I haven't
> had
> > > many
> > > >> opportunities to take my FT-470 outside with my Arrow and chase a
> > bird.
> > > >> The QSOs I've heard seem like they go so fast and I'd hate to annoy
> > > anyone
> > > >> by being the slowpoke.
> > > >> 73! Mike AF5AT
> > > >>
> > > >> On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 12:52 PM Brad Smith via AMSAT-BB <
> > > >> amsat-bb@?????.???>
> > > >> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> > I am a minimalist because I want to be a minimalist. I understand
> > that
> > > >> the
> > > >> > FM bird is nothing more than a repeater and the strongest signal
> > takes
> > > >> the
> > > >> > bird, even if someone else is talking. "Someone else is talking"
> is
> > > the
> > > >> > rude part. Last weekend, I was chasing a rover and got "KC9" out
> and
> > > >> into
> > > >> > the bird (I work full duplux, so know that I was in) and someone
> > took
> > > >> over
> > > >> > by stepping on me. Luckily, I got him anyway, but someone was high
> > > power
> > > >> > and more important than me. That's the way contesters work. But, I
> > > don't
> > > >> > want to plaster someone's call on the board. I just hope that the
> > > >> person is
> > > >> > a member and thinks about it. Getting into a peeing contest with
> > > >> someone is
> > > >> > not beneficial to anybody, including the hobby. It used to be that
> > if
> > > >> one
> > > >> > said "handheld" or "portable" guys would give them a break, but
> that
> > > >> > doesn't happen anymore. The birds are too crowded for that. There
> > are
> > > >> > several people in my ham clubs that want to try satellite
> operation
> > > and
> > > >> > myself and my friend Rick (WA9JBQ) loves to
> > > >> > mentor them and teach them the proper way to operate. Not
> everyone
> > > has
> > > >> > this benefit. I don't know what the answer is. Last Spring one ham
> > was
> > > >> an
> > > >> > extremely poor operator on the birds, but is now a better
> operator.
> > > So,
> > > >> > something works. But there is always the tendency to crank up the
> > > power
> > > >> to
> > > >> > get the station that you want, if you have the power available. It
> > is
> > > >> like
> > > >> > guys who I know that run 1,500 watts on FT8 to get what they
> want. I
> > > >> guess
> > > >> > it is going to happen and we have to live with that fact.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > As soon as I solve my equipment problem with my 847 and the
> weather
> > > >> turns
> > > >> > warmer, I will be back on the linear birds. I sure do miss FO-29.
> > Brad
> > > >> > KC9UQR
> > > >> > _______________________________________________
> > > >> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum
> > available
> > > >> > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> > > >> Opinions
> > > >> > expressed
> > > >> > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official
> > views
> > > of
> > > >> > AMSAT-NA.
> > > >> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> > > >> program!
> > > >> > Subscription settings:
> > > https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> > > >> >
> > > >> _______________________________________________
> > > >> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum
> available
> > > >> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> > > >> Opinions expressed
> > > >> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official
> views
> > of
> > > >> AMSAT-NA.
> > > >> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> > > program!
> > > >> Subscription settings:
> > https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> > > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> > Opinions
> > > expressed
> > > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views
> of
> > > AMSAT-NA.
> > > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> > program!
> > > Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> Opinions
> > expressed
> > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> > AMSAT-NA.
> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> program!
> > Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
> expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 14:12:07 -0700
From: KI7UNJ Tucker <ki7unj@?????.???>
To: John Geiger <af5cc2@?????.???>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Poor Operators
Message-ID:
<CAPFr_UnHwmv0Qv5uDoWWDiNNzw=G8uRg_D=yzNBEDzgKUsb0Mw@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Another "TIP" for the operator(s) who seem to be unable/refuse to say
the callsign they want to work. Screaming out "gridline station" or "roving
station" then your call trying to get them over and over.. is annoying.
As another op said to them once on the air "you want my gird say my call"
On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 12:54 PM John Geiger via AMSAT-BB <
amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
> Using phonetics can really help also, especially if you have letters that
> sound alike in your call, such as T and D.
>
> 73 John W5TD
>
> On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 2:40 PM John Kludt via AMSAT-BB <
> amsat-bb@?????.???>
> wrote:
>
> > All,
> >
> > There is another practice that I have not seen addressed here that makes
> > thing really tough - talking way too fast. I understand the reason but
> > fast talking just leads to the request for repeats which means more
> traffic
> > and/or busted Q's. So in addition to turn down the power how about
> > talking just a little slowly and more clearly?
> >
> > Just a suggestion.
> >
> > John K4SQC
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 3:03 PM Isaac C via AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???
> >
> > wrote:
> >
> > > ps -. it was SO-50, pass 11:58 local time, Mar 12.
> > >
> > > On Thursday, March 19, 2020, Isaac C <shorenicehere@?????.???> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Mike,
> > > > I am Isaac, W4ITC, grid FM14.
> > > > I am maybe two weeks ahead of you in the newbie category. I just got
> my
> > > > first QSO/QSL on March 12.
> > > > I connected with W0NBC.
> > > > After me, you can hear WB3CSY do an expert connection with someone
> > else.
> > > > I listened to many passed before I was brave enough to talk. It
> > probably
> > > > shows.
> > > > My rig is qty 2 Baofengs @ 5w with a WA5VJB home-made antenna.
> > > >
> > > > Best luck.
> > > >
> > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/14YSF3hL6NBtRMkcw3gDcx8VURQ3dB
> > > > UNl/view?usp=drivesdk
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Thursday, March 19, 2020, Mike Wilhelm via AMSAT-BB <
> > > amsat-bb@?????.???>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> I've been collecting equipment and waiting for the right time to try
> > and
> > > >> get on a bird. Life is too busy...
> > > >> Anyway, it might be helpful if there were a few audio examples we
> > could
> > > >> pass on to newbies and uninformed operators of good and bad
> operating.
> > > I
> > > >> would recommend beeping out any parts of the call sign for any
> > examples
> > > of
> > > >> poor operation. I'd sure like to hear them. Maybe even post them
> to
> > a
> > > >> section on the AMSAT page covering operating? I apologize if this
> is
> > > >> already out there...back to that too busy thing again. I haven't
> had
> > > many
> > > >> opportunities to take my FT-470 outside with my Arrow and chase a
> > bird.
> > > >> The QSOs I've heard seem like they go so fast and I'd hate to annoy
> > > anyone
> > > >> by being the slowpoke.
> > > >> 73! Mike AF5AT
> > > >>
> > > >> On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 12:52 PM Brad Smith via AMSAT-BB <
> > > >> amsat-bb@?????.???>
> > > >> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> > I am a minimalist because I want to be a minimalist. I understand
> > that
> > > >> the
> > > >> > FM bird is nothing more than a repeater and the strongest signal
> > takes
> > > >> the
> > > >> > bird, even if someone else is talking. "Someone else is talking"
> is
> > > the
> > > >> > rude part. Last weekend, I was chasing a rover and got "KC9" out
> and
> > > >> into
> > > >> > the bird (I work full duplux, so know that I was in) and someone
> > took
> > > >> over
> > > >> > by stepping on me. Luckily, I got him anyway, but someone was high
> > > power
> > > >> > and more important than me. That's the way contesters work. But, I
> > > don't
> > > >> > want to plaster someone's call on the board. I just hope that the
> > > >> person is
> > > >> > a member and thinks about it. Getting into a peeing contest with
> > > >> someone is
> > > >> > not beneficial to anybody, including the hobby. It used to be that
> > if
> > > >> one
> > > >> > said "handheld" or "portable" guys would give them a break, but
> that
> > > >> > doesn't happen anymore. The birds are too crowded for that. There
> > are
> > > >> > several people in my ham clubs that want to try satellite
> operation
> > > and
> > > >> > myself and my friend Rick (WA9JBQ) loves to
> > > >> > mentor them and teach them the proper way to operate. Not
> everyone
> > > has
> > > >> > this benefit. I don't know what the answer is. Last Spring one ham
> > was
> > > >> an
> > > >> > extremely poor operator on the birds, but is now a better
> operator.
> > > So,
> > > >> > something works. But there is always the tendency to crank up the
> > > power
> > > >> to
> > > >> > get the station that you want, if you have the power available. It
> > is
> > > >> like
> > > >> > guys who I know that run 1,500 watts on FT8 to get what they
> want. I
> > > >> guess
> > > >> > it is going to happen and we have to live with that fact.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > As soon as I solve my equipment problem with my 847 and the
> weather
> > > >> turns
> > > >> > warmer, I will be back on the linear birds. I sure do miss FO-29.
> > Brad
> > > >> > KC9UQR
> > > >> > _______________________________________________
> > > >> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum
> > available
> > > >> > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> > > >> Opinions
> > > >> > expressed
> > > >> > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official
> > views
> > > of
> > > >> > AMSAT-NA.
> > > >> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> > > >> program!
> > > >> > Subscription settings:
> > > https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> > > >> >
> > > >> _______________________________________________
> > > >> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum
> available
> > > >> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> > > >> Opinions expressed
> > > >> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official
> views
> > of
> > > >> AMSAT-NA.
> > > >> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> > > program!
> > > >> Subscription settings:
> > https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> > > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> > Opinions
> > > expressed
> > > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views
> of
> > > AMSAT-NA.
> > > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> > program!
> > > Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> > to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> Opinions
> > expressed
> > are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> > AMSAT-NA.
> > Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> program!
> > Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
> expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
--
*Casey Tucker KI7UNJ*
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 16:42:06 -0500
From: Matthew Chambers <mchambers@?????????.????>
To: "amsat-bb@?????.???? <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] QRP Days for FM Birds?
Message-ID:
<CA+0ZtTYTBW2Rfhn8309z=AsBNkuYjsZV=WDUG059r6ui1PbqUA@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
I second this idea and would love to have a day I could get in with my
mobile setup since I don't have an arrow yet. I would love to try to get in
with my FT8900 at 5 or 10w with 2m and a 70cm 1/4 whips on the roof of my
car.
Matthew Chambers, CBT, NR0Q
Owner/Engineer
*M Chambers Communications Engineering LLC*
PO BOX 855, Moberly, MO 65270
Mobile (660)415-5620
www.mchambersradio.com
On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 3:54 PM Hasan al-Basri via AMSAT-BB <
amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
> Why Not?
>
> I remember in "the old days" of Sat ops we used to have exactly that. A 24
> hour period where EIRP was limited.
> It was once a week on the same day. It started UTC 0000 and ran for 24
> hours. Then the normal free-for-all resumed. People, in those days, had
> enough self-respect and restraint to actually observe the QRP Day.
>
> It was the "honor" system. But it did allow a lot of marginally equipped
> stations to make a lot of satellite qsos. Even as recently as two years
> ago, I can remember standing next to my EggBeaters (7' off the ground),
> with a piece of coax going from my 5W H/T to the duplexer and up to the
> eggbeaters. I was able to make a qso then. Now, in most cases, it would be
> futile.
>
> I don't know if something like this could be organized for the FM birds,
> but if so, *it would need backing and publicizing by AMSAT*.
>
> It would be wonderful to hear people easily using the bird for even a few
> hours running nothing but an HT at 2.5 watts output and a hand held Arrow
> (or the equivalent of that say 10 watts to a simple 1/4w vertical)
>
> If we assume the handheld yagis have 10 dBi gain on 70cm, then the EIRP
> would be 25 watts.
>
> For home stations, the same idea. No more than 25 watts Effective Radiated
> Power (RF Output + Antenna Gain - Feedline Loss)
>
> A simple 1/4 wave vertical might be 2 dBi, so 10w would be in the ballpark.
>
> The goal would be to keep uplink power limited to 25 watts effective
> radiated power.
>
> QRP day could be a celebration of sorts, if it became popular ...there
> would be a sort of peer prestige thing take place, as opposed to worshiping
> the mighty grid.
>
> A grass roots approach won't work. It has to be led by people with some
> standing and credibility, and for AO-91 and AO-92 it would have to be
> AMSAT. It would require some real effort on their part, not just a by-line
> in the weekly news.
>
> Once it took hold, some self policing could probably keep it going.
>
> Just and idea for the FM birds. It might be fun. It might give more rovers
> and portable Ops a chance.
>
> The linear birds don't need it, as the strength of the user downlink signal
> is to be kept to no stronger than the CW beacon and we can easily identify
> the offenders.
> 73, N0AN
> Hasan
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
> expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
------------------------------
Subject: Digest Footer
_______________________________________________
Sent via amsat-bb@?????.???.
AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide
without requiring membership. Opinions expressed
are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
Not an AMSAT member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
End of AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 15, Issue 88
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