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Today's Topics:
1. Re: GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no, whining....(Was
need HEO..please..) (Jean Marc Momple)
2. Griffith Observer Magazine article on ALBERTASAT CubeSat
(aj9n@???.????
3. Re: GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no, whining....(Was
need HEO..please..) (Matthias Bopp)
4. Re: GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no, whining....(Was
need HEO..please..) (Bill Gaylord)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2020 21:24:05 +0400
From: Jean Marc Momple <jean.marc.momple@?????.???>
To: Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??>
Cc: "amsat-bb@?????.???? <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
Message-ID: <113D7E08-0A97-4CD2-B7C4-427C52256796@?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Roger and QSL, Mathias,
Yes, seems that the Pluto is quite popular on QO-100 particularly with the
TXCO modification posted on the WEB (sorry to the author I do not remind his
call and name), positive feedback received from many.
Yes, Simon did a great job and I take this opportunity to congratulate him
for same, his baby is being used by so many guys now that if it was a
commercial venture he would be very rich selling it. So, I believe that all
of us using his software, which has taken surely took a lot of effort and
hard work, should somehow contribute and compensate him with at least a beer
or something for his starving dog to motivate him for further improvement of
his superb soft as most of us tend to believe that everything should be free
of charge on the net. This also applies to many other HAMs devoting a lot
time and hard work for the community (over years) such as my friends Mike
(DK3WN) and Daniel (EA4GPZ) who both wrote a lot of TLM decoders for many
birds, also Andrei (UZ7HO) for his modems which are great, just to mention a
few (as there are many more).
That said I really believe that if we want more birds such as HEO or GEO to
have a truly global coverage we need to think big as a worldwide community
and also contribute to it (each one within its own means and possibilities),
however a common focus vision and goal across the globe is required to make
it happens. Our leaders globally may wish to give it a thought) and work
together a strategy/plan. I am ready do help and surely many others.
I really appreciate the effort and work of all the ones doing such a great
job of putting us in space and also wish to also congratule /thanks them for
their hard work (some were mentioned on this topic).
We need to think big (with unfortunately shallow pockets) but if we try hard
we may succeed with a constellation of birds and 24 hrs coverage across the
globe, just a dream I wish to share to all, it is possible if we can
federate all HAM organization around the planet (may be through IARU?) and
get support from some sponsors.
Just thinking aloud and dreaming this side, but with no dreams we go
nowhere...
73
Jean Marc (3B8DU)
> On Jun 22, 2020, at 9:15 PM, Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??> wrote:
>
> Hi Jean Marc,
>
> It is a pity that your Minitiouner and Pluto are damaged. I hope you can
possibly repair one or the other ...
>
> Actually, I prefer the Lime-USB for narrowband operations on QO-100.
>
> I modified the Pluto for external reference and thus it is also stable.
Yet I use it mostly for DATV-TX.
>
> I agree that SDR-Console is a great tool for operations via QO-100 and the
majority of the QO-100 operators are meanwhile using it.
> Simon has spent a lot of work on getting the Lime-SDR and Pluto-SDR
working fine including locking the RX chain to the PSK beacon.
> I remember in the "hot phase" of his development which lasted about 3
months several Beta-Testers including myself spent many
> hours in testing the various beta-versions from Simon.
>
> I am looking forward to talk to you again on QO-100-
>
> Kind regards
>
> Matthias
>
> www.dd1us.de
>
>
>
> -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Jean Marc Momple <jean.marc.momple@?????.???>
> Gesendet: Montag, 22. Juni 2020 18:43
> An: Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??>
> Cc: amsat-bb@?????.???
> Betreff: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
>
> Mathias,
>
> Yes, the Minitiouner is really great for ATV, unfortunately mine is kaput
due to an accidental short circuit cause by my dog (hi!) and therefore less
active on ATV these days. I need to order another one but waiting for
commercial opening of the airways to Europe.
>
> I prefer the Lime as the Pluto drift is annoying (but manageable), anyway
my Pluto also kaput due to same incident stated above so using the Lime.
>
> All these relatively cheap hardware and a computer makes it so easy and
open such great experiments. As a matter of fact with a RTL SDR costing only
US$24 I uploaded more than a million of Telemetry frames to various
organisations such as Satnogs, Funcube, AMSAT (Foxtelem), Universities, even
to Harbin for the Lunar bird, etc.
>
> Also to share, made many experiment with LNB?s for QO-100, modified quite
a few LNB?s, tested many from the most expensive such as the Bullseye,
Octagon, to the cheapest Chinese PLL (at US$ 3), all work fine on QO-100
with SDR Console (thanks to Simon Brown G4ELI) particularly with the GEO sync.
>
> 73
>
>
>
> Jean Marc (3B8DU)
>
>
>
>> On Jun 21, 2020, at 7:58 PM, Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Jean-Marc,
>>
>> Very good point.
>>
>> Actually if you use a Pluto you can use it also with a software based
free solution to receive the WB Transponder without additional cost.
>>
>> To receive the WB Transponder I prefer the Minitiouner kits from REF or
BATC for about 100 Euros which is still a very cost effective solution.
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>> Matthias
>>
>> www.dd1us.de
>>
>>
>> Originalnachricht
>> Von: Jean Marc Momple
>> Gesendet: Sonntag, 21. Juni 2020 17:38
>> An: Matthias Bopp
>> Cc: amsat-bb@?????.???
>> Betreff: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
>> whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
>>
>>
>> Dear All,
>>
>> Forgot to say a major positive about QO-100 which is the cost of setting
up a Ground Station for narrow the band transponder, assuming that the PC is
already available and that one use a Tx/Rx such as the Pluto or Lime SDR,s a
few Chinese WiFi booster, a PLL LNB and a 80cm dish, the total cost is less
than US$ 400.
>>
>> This is really attractive to students and for all Ham?s with modest means
compared with buying any commercially available transceiver (or may be 2
actually) for satellite operations, thus cost of entry in QO-100 is really
affordable to newbies, more these guys may immediately jump in real Dx QSO?s
and learn the trade, this surely motivate them for further experimentation.
Particularly in remote Islands like us in that part of the globe.
>>
>> My 1 cent additional input to the subject.
>>
>> 73
>>
>>
>> Jean Marc (3B8DU)
>>
>>> On Jun 20, 2020, at 6:50 PM, Jean Marc Momple
<jean.marc.momple@?????.???> wrote:
>>>
>>> Mattias,
>>>
>>> Thanks for having corrected the matter which may have created wrong
perceptions.
>>>
>>> Thanks to AMSAT DL, QARS and the sponsors who made such a great Radio
Amateur bird possible, again congratulations for that.
>>>
>>> That said I wish to confirm/comment your last paragraph, as follows:
>>>
>>> In the Indian Ocean FR (mainly Reunion Island and 3B* Mauritius) we are
only a few Hams. With HF not going through these days the hobby was somehow
left on the side by some and QO-100 has really revived the activities.
>>>
>>> To share my personal case I was able to experiment microwave (2.4/10GHz)
and modes such as ATV for the first time in my Ham life (licensed since
1977) as there was no-one around to be able to contact on these bands and
modes. Now building a 3m dish experiment different types of feeds etc..
(some other local guys also and even students).
>>>
>>> In a nutshell a new world (or at least a half one) made available to us,
many experimentations and learnings. I feel like again being 16 (age when I
got my licence) as building antennas again, feeds, assembly of various
components to build the QO-100 station.
>>>
>>> I just hope the ones not in coverage presently will get a in a Ham GEO
coverage soon and hopefully will fully understand what it means really.
>>>
>>> 73
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Jean Marc (3B8DU)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Jun 20, 2020, at 12:29 PM, Matthias Bopp via AMSAT-BB
<amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Paul,
>>>>
>>>> With all due respect. I already tried to explain to you less than 48
>>>> hours ago: this is not just a simple retuned hardware on QO-100
>>>>
>>>> You stated "It?s important to note that QO-100 is not an amateur
payload at all."
>>>> The payload was specified by AMSAT and during the design AMSAT did
participate in all critical design reviews. AMSAT indeed first intended to
build the transponders themselves.
>>>> The owner of the satellite did trust the technical knowhow of AMSAT
but for safety and insurance reasons the hardware was built by a
professional company.
>>>> Of course, QO-100 was coordinated via IARU and fully qualifies as an
amateur satellite (payload). Therefore, it got the number 100 (from AMSAT-NA).
>>>>
>>>> You stated "The two transponders in amateur use are on-orbit commercial
spares modified to tune to amateur frequencies."
>>>> Let me explain it in simple words so you understand: you cannot
simply retune a WCDMA cellphone and use it as a 2m FM handheld transceiver
>>>> The hardware in commercial satellite transponders is not meant to be
a linear transponder with an AGC etc.
>>>> In addition, there are no 2.4GHz/10GHz transponders on commercial
satellites.
>>>> Thus, the hardware had to be custom built for QO-100. The same is
true for the uplink and downlink antennas. The only parts which are reused
are the TWT PAs.
>>>>
>>>> So please, if you need help to understand the architecture or the
published block diagram of the amateur payload please contact the
responsible people of AMSAT-DL and they will be happy to help you.
>>>> But please stop commenting about a satellite you have apparently no
clue about or you do not understand the underlying technology.
>>>>
>>>> In any case, meanwhile there more than 1000 happy users in more than
100 countries who are enjoying QO-100 using many different operating modes.
>>>> QO-100 has stimulated a lot of technical activities in the microwave
bands and a lot of radio amateurs, who never used the microwave bands,
learned how to build and operate a station with 13cm uplink and 10 GHz
downlink.
>>>>
>>>> Kind regards
>>>>
>>>> Matthias
>>>>
>>>> www.dd1us.de
>>>>
>>>> -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
>>>> Von: AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb-bounces@?????.???> Im Auftrag von Paul
>>>> Stoetzer via AMSAT-BB
>>>> Gesendet: Samstag, 20. Juni 2020 06:21
>>>> An: Joe Leikhim <rhyolite@???????.???>
>>>> Cc: amsat-bb@?????.???
>>>> Betreff: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
>>>> whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
>>>>
>>>> Joe,
>>>>
>>>> It?s important to note that QO-100 is not an amateur payload at all.
The two transponders in amateur use are on-orbit commercial spares modified
to tune to amateur frequencies. And, of course, there?s the risk that the
spares may be needed for commercial service some day.
>>>>
>>>> The issue is that to get an American company to do this, you need
millions of dollars up front and then probably millions of dollars a year to
support it. It?s been looked into multiple times over the years and no one
is willing to just give that away or even quote a price that?s remotely
reasonable.
>>>>
>>>> I do take issue with your choice of words in describing GOLF-TEE as
?baby steps.? GOLF is a project that AMSAT has committed a large amount of
money and man-hours to. It is a very significant project and will lead us
back to HEO. Our engineering team is doing tremendous work and deserves the
full support and encouragement of the amateur community. Sadly, I feel that
support is often lacking and, frankly, our volunteers deserve better than
that.
>>>>
>>>> If you want a HEO, support AMSAT and GOLF in any way that you can.
AMSAT is 100% committed and I am personally 100% committed to making this
happen for the community.
>>>>
>>>> 73,
>>>>
>>>> Paul Stoetzer, N8HM
>>>> Executive Vice President
>>>> AMSAT
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 00:01 Joe Leikhim via AMSAT-BB
>>>> <amsat-bb@?????.???>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Robert;
>>>>>
>>>>> AMSAT has been in HEO before and can get there again.
>>>>>
>>>>> The idea of my proposal is to piggy back on a willing commercial
>>>>> satellite. The owner of that satellite would be handling the
>>>>> necessary regulatory issues/problems. This idea has been proposed
>>>>> before but convincing a commercial satellite owner to attach
>>>>> unproven payload has always been an negative argument. No longer,
>>>>> because OSCAR-100 is proven hardware and it should be considered.
>>>>>
>>>>> Meanwhile GOLF-TEE can continue to take baby steps.
>>>>>
>>>>> Looking for ideas to promote this idea. Be positive.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Joe Leikhim
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Leikhim and Associates
>>>>>
>>>>> Communications Consultants
>>>>>
>>>>> Oviedo, Florida
>>>>>
>>>>> JLeikhim@???????.???
>>>>>
>>>>> 407-982-0446
>>>>>
>>>>> WWW.LEIKHIM.COM
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum
>>>>> available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring
membership.
>>>>> Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not
>>>>> reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA.
>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
>>>>> Subscription settings:
>>>>> https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official
views of AMSAT-NA.
>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
>>>> Subscription settings:
>>>> https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum
>>>> available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring
>>>> membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do
not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA.
>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
>>>> Subscription settings:
>>>> https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>
>>
>
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2020 18:04:09 +0000 (UTC)
From: aj9n@???.???
To: amsat-bb@?????.???
Subject: [amsat-bb] Griffith Observer Magazine article on ALBERTASAT
CubeSat
Message-ID: <1215351309.1796822.1592935449655@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Hi all,
I don't know how many of you are a member of the Griffith Observatory in Los
Angeles but I am and I just received the latest copy of their Griffith
Observer magazine.? Volume 84, Number 7 July 2020, has a nice article on the
University of Alberta's (ALBERTASAT) efforts with building a CubeSat.? Their
first satellite was called EX-ALTA 1 (it deorbited on November 14, 2018).?
This is article is entitled CubeSats: The People's Satellites and is written
by Dr. Annie Prud'homme-G?n?reux and was awarded First Prize in the annual
Joan and Arnold Seidel Griffith Observer Science Writing Contest.
I don't see any direct reference to any AMSAT efforts but the article does
mention that CubeSats were pioneered in 1999 by Jordi Puig-Suari of the
California Polytechnic State University and Bob Twiggs of Stanford
University.? There is also mention that the beacon was first heard by hams
in Japan.
The article explains what the students went through in developing their
CubeSat.? And since their first one has returned to earth, they discuss
their future efforts in building and funding version 2.
More info can be found at:
http://www.griffithobservatory.org/programs/observer.htmlOrder forms for
getting a reprint of the magazine can be found on this page.
73,Charlie Sufana AJ9NOne of the ARISS mentors
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2020 19:32:00 +0000
From: Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??>
To: "amsat-bb@?????.???? <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
Message-ID:
<LEXPR01MB0493EF676642C032C6CFE97ADE940@?????????????.????????.????.???????.??
>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi Jean Marc,
If remember right, Sigi DG9BFC and Sandor DM4DS were the first who modified
the Pluto using a better TCXO and for sure they helped a lot of other HAMs
to get it done or even did the modification for them.
Simon not only enabled us to use SDR-Technology in a nice ready-made
software package but also added satellite tracking capabilities to his
software. And for sure Mike, Daniel, Andrej and several
others are providing a great service to our Ham Radio Community with their
software and by sharing their experience. It is all about learning from each
other as life is too short to do all on our own.
The Cubesat frame structure, quite some components and even the deployment
systems have been successfully standardized and thus it got much easier to
build and get them launched.
Still each successful deployment of them is a remarkable accomplishment by
the teams behind.
I am afraid that developing and building a HEO or GEO-payload and getting a
launch for it is a world of difference.
But of course, one can learn from the Cubesat projects. Standardizing the
frame structure and the subsystems might be one of the key factors to make
your dream true and to succeed with a constellation of such satellites.
I agree the chances should be much higher to accomplish this ambitious goal
if cooperating across countries and continents. I am not so familiar with
the international Ham Radio organizations and thus I cannot judge
whether IARU is a suitable organization to facilitate such an international
effort.
In my humble opinion the main challenge is to find an appropriate launch
opportunity for a HEO respectively a rideshare for a GEO. For sure it is
nowadays not easier than at the times of AO10, AO13 and AO40.
Also here leveraging international resources and relationships should help.
Maybe we can find another sponsor like Es'hailSat.
Kind regards
Matthias
www.dd1us.de
-----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Jean Marc Momple <jean.marc.momple@?????.???>
Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Juni 2020 19:24
An: Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??>
Cc: amsat-bb@?????.???
Betreff: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
Roger and QSL, Mathias,
Yes, seems that the Pluto is quite popular on QO-100 particularly with the
TXCO modification posted on the WEB (sorry to the author I do not remind his
call and name), positive feedback received from many.
Yes, Simon did a great job and I take this opportunity to congratulate him
for same, his baby is being used by so many guys now that if it was a
commercial venture he would be very rich selling it. So, I believe that all
of us using his software, which has taken surely took a lot of effort and
hard work, should somehow contribute and compensate him with at least a beer
or something for his starving dog to motivate him for further improvement of
his superb soft as most of us tend to believe that everything should be free
of charge on the net. This also applies to many other HAMs devoting a lot
time and hard work for the community (over years) such as my friends Mike
(DK3WN) and Daniel (EA4GPZ) who both wrote a lot of TLM decoders for many
birds, also Andrei (UZ7HO) for his modems which are great, just to mention a
few (as there are many more).
That said I really believe that if we want more birds such as HEO or GEO to
have a truly global coverage we need to think big as a worldwide community
and also contribute to it (each one within its own means and possibilities),
however a common focus vision and goal across the globe is required to make
it happens. Our leaders globally may wish to give it a thought) and work
together a strategy/plan. I am ready do help and surely many others.
I really appreciate the effort and work of all the ones doing such a great
job of putting us in space and also wish to also congratule /thanks them for
their hard work (some were mentioned on this topic).
We need to think big (with unfortunately shallow pockets) but if we try hard
we may succeed with a constellation of birds and 24 hrs coverage across the
globe, just a dream I wish to share to all, it is possible if we can
federate all HAM organization around the planet (may be through IARU?) and
get support from some sponsors.
Just thinking aloud and dreaming this side, but with no dreams we go
nowhere...
73
Jean Marc (3B8DU)
> On Jun 22, 2020, at 9:15 PM, Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??> wrote:
>
> Hi Jean Marc,
>
> It is a pity that your Minitiouner and Pluto are damaged. I hope you can
possibly repair one or the other ...
>
> Actually, I prefer the Lime-USB for narrowband operations on QO-100.
>
> I modified the Pluto for external reference and thus it is also stable.
Yet I use it mostly for DATV-TX.
>
> I agree that SDR-Console is a great tool for operations via QO-100 and the
majority of the QO-100 operators are meanwhile using it.
> Simon has spent a lot of work on getting the Lime-SDR and Pluto-SDR
working fine including locking the RX chain to the PSK beacon.
> I remember in the "hot phase" of his development which lasted about 3
> months several Beta-Testers including myself spent many hours in testing
the various beta-versions from Simon.
>
> I am looking forward to talk to you again on QO-100-
>
> Kind regards
>
> Matthias
>
> www.dd1us.de
>
>
>
> -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Jean Marc Momple <jean.marc.momple@?????.???>
> Gesendet: Montag, 22. Juni 2020 18:43
> An: Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??>
> Cc: amsat-bb@?????.???
> Betreff: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
> whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
>
> Mathias,
>
> Yes, the Minitiouner is really great for ATV, unfortunately mine is kaput
due to an accidental short circuit cause by my dog (hi!) and therefore less
active on ATV these days. I need to order another one but waiting for
commercial opening of the airways to Europe.
>
> I prefer the Lime as the Pluto drift is annoying (but manageable), anyway
my Pluto also kaput due to same incident stated above so using the Lime.
>
> All these relatively cheap hardware and a computer makes it so easy and
open such great experiments. As a matter of fact with a RTL SDR costing only
US$24 I uploaded more than a million of Telemetry frames to various
organisations such as Satnogs, Funcube, AMSAT (Foxtelem), Universities, even
to Harbin for the Lunar bird, etc.
>
> Also to share, made many experiment with LNB?s for QO-100, modified quite
a few LNB?s, tested many from the most expensive such as the Bullseye,
Octagon, to the cheapest Chinese PLL (at US$ 3), all work fine on QO-100
with SDR Console (thanks to Simon Brown G4ELI) particularly with the GEO sync.
>
> 73
>
>
>
> Jean Marc (3B8DU)
>
>
>
>> On Jun 21, 2020, at 7:58 PM, Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Jean-Marc,
>>
>> Very good point.
>>
>> Actually if you use a Pluto you can use it also with a software based
free solution to receive the WB Transponder without additional cost.
>>
>> To receive the WB Transponder I prefer the Minitiouner kits from REF or
BATC for about 100 Euros which is still a very cost effective solution.
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>> Matthias
>>
>> www.dd1us.de
>>
>>
>> Originalnachricht
>> Von: Jean Marc Momple
>> Gesendet: Sonntag, 21. Juni 2020 17:38
>> An: Matthias Bopp
>> Cc: amsat-bb@?????.???
>> Betreff: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
>> whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
>>
>>
>> Dear All,
>>
>> Forgot to say a major positive about QO-100 which is the cost of setting
up a Ground Station for narrow the band transponder, assuming that the PC is
already available and that one use a Tx/Rx such as the Pluto or Lime SDR,s a
few Chinese WiFi booster, a PLL LNB and a 80cm dish, the total cost is less
than US$ 400.
>>
>> This is really attractive to students and for all Ham?s with modest means
compared with buying any commercially available transceiver (or may be 2
actually) for satellite operations, thus cost of entry in QO-100 is really
affordable to newbies, more these guys may immediately jump in real Dx QSO?s
and learn the trade, this surely motivate them for further experimentation.
Particularly in remote Islands like us in that part of the globe.
>>
>> My 1 cent additional input to the subject.
>>
>> 73
>>
>>
>> Jean Marc (3B8DU)
>>
>>> On Jun 20, 2020, at 6:50 PM, Jean Marc Momple
<jean.marc.momple@?????.???> wrote:
>>>
>>> Mattias,
>>>
>>> Thanks for having corrected the matter which may have created wrong
perceptions.
>>>
>>> Thanks to AMSAT DL, QARS and the sponsors who made such a great Radio
Amateur bird possible, again congratulations for that.
>>>
>>> That said I wish to confirm/comment your last paragraph, as follows:
>>>
>>> In the Indian Ocean FR (mainly Reunion Island and 3B* Mauritius) we are
only a few Hams. With HF not going through these days the hobby was somehow
left on the side by some and QO-100 has really revived the activities.
>>>
>>> To share my personal case I was able to experiment microwave (2.4/10GHz)
and modes such as ATV for the first time in my Ham life (licensed since
1977) as there was no-one around to be able to contact on these bands and
modes. Now building a 3m dish experiment different types of feeds etc..
(some other local guys also and even students).
>>>
>>> In a nutshell a new world (or at least a half one) made available to us,
many experimentations and learnings. I feel like again being 16 (age when I
got my licence) as building antennas again, feeds, assembly of various
components to build the QO-100 station.
>>>
>>> I just hope the ones not in coverage presently will get a in a Ham GEO
coverage soon and hopefully will fully understand what it means really.
>>>
>>> 73
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Jean Marc (3B8DU)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Jun 20, 2020, at 12:29 PM, Matthias Bopp via AMSAT-BB
<amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Paul,
>>>>
>>>> With all due respect. I already tried to explain to you less than
>>>> 48 hours ago: this is not just a simple retuned hardware on QO-100
>>>>
>>>> You stated "It?s important to note that QO-100 is not an amateur
payload at all."
>>>> The payload was specified by AMSAT and during the design AMSAT did
participate in all critical design reviews. AMSAT indeed first intended to
build the transponders themselves.
>>>> The owner of the satellite did trust the technical knowhow of AMSAT
but for safety and insurance reasons the hardware was built by a
professional company.
>>>> Of course, QO-100 was coordinated via IARU and fully qualifies as an
amateur satellite (payload). Therefore, it got the number 100 (from AMSAT-NA).
>>>>
>>>> You stated "The two transponders in amateur use are on-orbit commercial
spares modified to tune to amateur frequencies."
>>>> Let me explain it in simple words so you understand: you cannot
simply retune a WCDMA cellphone and use it as a 2m FM handheld transceiver
>>>> The hardware in commercial satellite transponders is not meant to be
a linear transponder with an AGC etc.
>>>> In addition, there are no 2.4GHz/10GHz transponders on commercial
satellites.
>>>> Thus, the hardware had to be custom built for QO-100. The same is
true for the uplink and downlink antennas. The only parts which are reused
are the TWT PAs.
>>>>
>>>> So please, if you need help to understand the architecture or the
published block diagram of the amateur payload please contact the
responsible people of AMSAT-DL and they will be happy to help you.
>>>> But please stop commenting about a satellite you have apparently no
clue about or you do not understand the underlying technology.
>>>>
>>>> In any case, meanwhile there more than 1000 happy users in more than
100 countries who are enjoying QO-100 using many different operating modes.
>>>> QO-100 has stimulated a lot of technical activities in the microwave
bands and a lot of radio amateurs, who never used the microwave bands,
learned how to build and operate a station with 13cm uplink and 10 GHz
downlink.
>>>>
>>>> Kind regards
>>>>
>>>> Matthias
>>>>
>>>> www.dd1us.de
>>>>
>>>> -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
>>>> Von: AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb-bounces@?????.???> Im Auftrag von Paul
>>>> Stoetzer via AMSAT-BB
>>>> Gesendet: Samstag, 20. Juni 2020 06:21
>>>> An: Joe Leikhim <rhyolite@???????.???>
>>>> Cc: amsat-bb@?????.???
>>>> Betreff: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
>>>> whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
>>>>
>>>> Joe,
>>>>
>>>> It?s important to note that QO-100 is not an amateur payload at all.
The two transponders in amateur use are on-orbit commercial spares modified
to tune to amateur frequencies. And, of course, there?s the risk that the
spares may be needed for commercial service some day.
>>>>
>>>> The issue is that to get an American company to do this, you need
millions of dollars up front and then probably millions of dollars a year to
support it. It?s been looked into multiple times over the years and no one
is willing to just give that away or even quote a price that?s remotely
reasonable.
>>>>
>>>> I do take issue with your choice of words in describing GOLF-TEE as
?baby steps.? GOLF is a project that AMSAT has committed a large amount of
money and man-hours to. It is a very significant project and will lead us
back to HEO. Our engineering team is doing tremendous work and deserves the
full support and encouragement of the amateur community. Sadly, I feel that
support is often lacking and, frankly, our volunteers deserve better than
that.
>>>>
>>>> If you want a HEO, support AMSAT and GOLF in any way that you can.
AMSAT is 100% committed and I am personally 100% committed to making this
happen for the community.
>>>>
>>>> 73,
>>>>
>>>> Paul Stoetzer, N8HM
>>>> Executive Vice President
>>>> AMSAT
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 00:01 Joe Leikhim via AMSAT-BB
>>>> <amsat-bb@?????.???>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Robert;
>>>>>
>>>>> AMSAT has been in HEO before and can get there again.
>>>>>
>>>>> The idea of my proposal is to piggy back on a willing commercial
>>>>> satellite. The owner of that satellite would be handling the
>>>>> necessary regulatory issues/problems. This idea has been proposed
>>>>> before but convincing a commercial satellite owner to attach
>>>>> unproven payload has always been an negative argument. No longer,
>>>>> because OSCAR-100 is proven hardware and it should be considered.
>>>>>
>>>>> Meanwhile GOLF-TEE can continue to take baby steps.
>>>>>
>>>>> Looking for ideas to promote this idea. Be positive.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Joe Leikhim
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Leikhim and Associates
>>>>>
>>>>> Communications Consultants
>>>>>
>>>>> Oviedo, Florida
>>>>>
>>>>> JLeikhim@???????.???
>>>>>
>>>>> 407-982-0446
>>>>>
>>>>> WWW.LEIKHIM.COM
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum
>>>>> available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring
membership.
>>>>> Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not
>>>>> reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA.
>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
>>>>> Subscription settings:
>>>>> https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official
views of AMSAT-NA.
>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
>>>> Subscription settings:
>>>> https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum
>>>> available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring
>>>> membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do
not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA.
>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
>>>> Subscription settings:
>>>> https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>
>>
>
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 2020 14:49:49 -0500
From: Bill Gaylord <chibill110@?????.???>
Cc: "amsat-bb@?????.???? <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
Message-ID: <21497E65-C180-4A10-9202-2DEF0C01CD4A@?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
What about putting a larger Cubesat (multiple U) into a highly elliptical
orbit?
> On Jun 23, 2020, at 2:42 PM, Matthias Bopp via AMSAT-BB
<amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
>
> ?Hi Jean Marc,
>
> If remember right, Sigi DG9BFC and Sandor DM4DS were the first who
modified the Pluto using a better TCXO and for sure they helped a lot of
other HAMs to get it done or even did the modification for them.
>
> Simon not only enabled us to use SDR-Technology in a nice ready-made
software package but also added satellite tracking capabilities to his
software. And for sure Mike, Daniel, Andrej and several
> others are providing a great service to our Ham Radio Community with their
software and by sharing their experience. It is all about learning from each
other as life is too short to do all on our own.
>
> The Cubesat frame structure, quite some components and even the deployment
systems have been successfully standardized and thus it got much easier to
build and get them launched.
> Still each successful deployment of them is a remarkable accomplishment by
the teams behind.
>
> I am afraid that developing and building a HEO or GEO-payload and getting
a launch for it is a world of difference.
>
> But of course, one can learn from the Cubesat projects. Standardizing the
frame structure and the subsystems might be one of the key factors to make
your dream true and to succeed with a constellation of such satellites.
> I agree the chances should be much higher to accomplish this ambitious
goal if cooperating across countries and continents. I am not so familiar
with the international Ham Radio organizations and thus I cannot judge
> whether IARU is a suitable organization to facilitate such an
international effort.
>
> In my humble opinion the main challenge is to find an appropriate launch
opportunity for a HEO respectively a rideshare for a GEO. For sure it is
nowadays not easier than at the times of AO10, AO13 and AO40.
> Also here leveraging international resources and relationships should
help. Maybe we can find another sponsor like Es'hailSat.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Matthias
>
> www.dd1us.de
>
>
> -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Jean Marc Momple <jean.marc.momple@?????.???>
> Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Juni 2020 19:24
> An: Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??>
> Cc: amsat-bb@?????.???
> Betreff: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
>
> Roger and QSL, Mathias,
>
> Yes, seems that the Pluto is quite popular on QO-100 particularly with the
TXCO modification posted on the WEB (sorry to the author I do not remind his
call and name), positive feedback received from many.
>
> Yes, Simon did a great job and I take this opportunity to congratulate him
for same, his baby is being used by so many guys now that if it was a
commercial venture he would be very rich selling it. So, I believe that all
of us using his software, which has taken surely took a lot of effort and
hard work, should somehow contribute and compensate him with at least a beer
or something for his starving dog to motivate him for further improvement of
his superb soft as most of us tend to believe that everything should be free
of charge on the net. This also applies to many other HAMs devoting a lot
time and hard work for the community (over years) such as my friends Mike
(DK3WN) and Daniel (EA4GPZ) who both wrote a lot of TLM decoders for many
birds, also Andrei (UZ7HO) for his modems which are great, just to mention a
few (as there are many more).
>
> That said I really believe that if we want more birds such as HEO or GEO
to have a truly global coverage we need to think big as a worldwide
community and also contribute to it (each one within its own means and
possibilities), however a common focus vision and goal across the globe is
required to make it happens. Our leaders globally may wish to give it a
thought) and work together a strategy/plan. I am ready do help and surely
many others.
>
> I really appreciate the effort and work of all the ones doing such a great
job of putting us in space and also wish to also congratule /thanks them for
their hard work (some were mentioned on this topic).
>
> We need to think big (with unfortunately shallow pockets) but if we try
hard we may succeed with a constellation of birds and 24 hrs coverage across
the globe, just a dream I wish to share to all, it is possible if we can
federate all HAM organization around the planet (may be through IARU?) and
get support from some sponsors.
>
> Just thinking aloud and dreaming this side, but with no dreams we go
nowhere...
>
> 73
>
>
> Jean Marc (3B8DU)
>
>
>
>> On Jun 22, 2020, at 9:15 PM, Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Jean Marc,
>>
>> It is a pity that your Minitiouner and Pluto are damaged. I hope you can
possibly repair one or the other ...
>>
>> Actually, I prefer the Lime-USB for narrowband operations on QO-100.
>>
>> I modified the Pluto for external reference and thus it is also stable.
Yet I use it mostly for DATV-TX.
>>
>> I agree that SDR-Console is a great tool for operations via QO-100 and
the majority of the QO-100 operators are meanwhile using it.
>> Simon has spent a lot of work on getting the Lime-SDR and Pluto-SDR
working fine including locking the RX chain to the PSK beacon.
>> I remember in the "hot phase" of his development which lasted about 3
>> months several Beta-Testers including myself spent many hours in testing
the various beta-versions from Simon.
>>
>> I am looking forward to talk to you again on QO-100-
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>> Matthias
>>
>> www.dd1us.de
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
>> Von: Jean Marc Momple <jean.marc.momple@?????.???>
>> Gesendet: Montag, 22. Juni 2020 18:43
>> An: Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??>
>> Cc: amsat-bb@?????.???
>> Betreff: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
>> whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
>>
>> Mathias,
>>
>> Yes, the Minitiouner is really great for ATV, unfortunately mine is kaput
due to an accidental short circuit cause by my dog (hi!) and therefore less
active on ATV these days. I need to order another one but waiting for
commercial opening of the airways to Europe.
>>
>> I prefer the Lime as the Pluto drift is annoying (but manageable), anyway
my Pluto also kaput due to same incident stated above so using the Lime.
>>
>> All these relatively cheap hardware and a computer makes it so easy and
open such great experiments. As a matter of fact with a RTL SDR costing only
US$24 I uploaded more than a million of Telemetry frames to various
organisations such as Satnogs, Funcube, AMSAT (Foxtelem), Universities, even
to Harbin for the Lunar bird, etc.
>>
>> Also to share, made many experiment with LNB?s for QO-100, modified quite
a few LNB?s, tested many from the most expensive such as the Bullseye,
Octagon, to the cheapest Chinese PLL (at US$ 3), all work fine on QO-100
with SDR Console (thanks to Simon Brown G4ELI) particularly with the GEO sync.
>>
>> 73
>>
>>
>>
>> Jean Marc (3B8DU)
>>
>>
>>
>>>> On Jun 21, 2020, at 7:58 PM, Matthias Bopp <matthias.bopp@?????.??>
wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Jean-Marc,
>>>
>>> Very good point.
>>>
>>> Actually if you use a Pluto you can use it also with a software based
free solution to receive the WB Transponder without additional cost.
>>>
>>> To receive the WB Transponder I prefer the Minitiouner kits from REF or
BATC for about 100 Euros which is still a very cost effective solution.
>>>
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>> Matthias
>>>
>>> www.dd1us.de
>>>
>>>
>>> Originalnachricht
>>> Von: Jean Marc Momple
>>> Gesendet: Sonntag, 21. Juni 2020 17:38
>>> An: Matthias Bopp
>>> Cc: amsat-bb@?????.???
>>> Betreff: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
>>> whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
>>>
>>>
>>> Dear All,
>>>
>>> Forgot to say a major positive about QO-100 which is the cost of setting
up a Ground Station for narrow the band transponder, assuming that the PC is
already available and that one use a Tx/Rx such as the Pluto or Lime SDR,s a
few Chinese WiFi booster, a PLL LNB and a 80cm dish, the total cost is less
than US$ 400.
>>>
>>> This is really attractive to students and for all Ham?s with modest
means compared with buying any commercially available transceiver (or may be
2 actually) for satellite operations, thus cost of entry in QO-100 is
really affordable to newbies, more these guys may immediately jump in real
Dx QSO?s and learn the trade, this surely motivate them for further
experimentation. Particularly in remote Islands like us in that part of the
globe.
>>>
>>> My 1 cent additional input to the subject.
>>>
>>> 73
>>>
>>>
>>> Jean Marc (3B8DU)
>>>
>>>> On Jun 20, 2020, at 6:50 PM, Jean Marc Momple
<jean.marc.momple@?????.???> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Mattias,
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for having corrected the matter which may have created wrong
perceptions.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks to AMSAT DL, QARS and the sponsors who made such a great Radio
Amateur bird possible, again congratulations for that.
>>>>
>>>> That said I wish to confirm/comment your last paragraph, as follows:
>>>>
>>>> In the Indian Ocean FR (mainly Reunion Island and 3B* Mauritius) we are
only a few Hams. With HF not going through these days the hobby was somehow
left on the side by some and QO-100 has really revived the activities.
>>>>
>>>> To share my personal case I was able to experiment microwave
(2.4/10GHz) and modes such as ATV for the first time in my Ham life
(licensed since 1977) as there was no-one around to be able to contact on
these bands and modes. Now building a 3m dish experiment different types of
feeds etc.. (some other local guys also and even students).
>>>>
>>>> In a nutshell a new world (or at least a half one) made available to
us, many experimentations and learnings. I feel like again being 16 (age
when I got my licence) as building antennas again, feeds, assembly of
various components to build the QO-100 station.
>>>>
>>>> I just hope the ones not in coverage presently will get a in a Ham GEO
coverage soon and hopefully will fully understand what it means really.
>>>>
>>>> 73
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Jean Marc (3B8DU)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Jun 20, 2020, at 12:29 PM, Matthias Bopp via AMSAT-BB
<amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Paul,
>>>>>
>>>>> With all due respect. I already tried to explain to you less than
>>>>> 48 hours ago: this is not just a simple retuned hardware on QO-100
>>>>>
>>>>> You stated "It?s important to note that QO-100 is not an amateur
payload at all."
>>>>> The payload was specified by AMSAT and during the design AMSAT did
participate in all critical design reviews. AMSAT indeed first intended to
build the transponders themselves.
>>>>> The owner of the satellite did trust the technical knowhow of AMSAT
but for safety and insurance reasons the hardware was built by a
professional company.
>>>>> Of course, QO-100 was coordinated via IARU and fully qualifies as an
amateur satellite (payload). Therefore, it got the number 100 (from AMSAT-NA).
>>>>>
>>>>> You stated "The two transponders in amateur use are on-orbit
commercial spares modified to tune to amateur frequencies."
>>>>> Let me explain it in simple words so you understand: you cannot
simply retune a WCDMA cellphone and use it as a 2m FM handheld transceiver
>>>>> The hardware in commercial satellite transponders is not meant to be
a linear transponder with an AGC etc.
>>>>> In addition, there are no 2.4GHz/10GHz transponders on commercial
satellites.
>>>>> Thus, the hardware had to be custom built for QO-100. The same is
true for the uplink and downlink antennas. The only parts which are reused
are the TWT PAs.
>>>>>
>>>>> So please, if you need help to understand the architecture or the
published block diagram of the amateur payload please contact the
responsible people of AMSAT-DL and they will be happy to help you.
>>>>> But please stop commenting about a satellite you have apparently no
clue about or you do not understand the underlying technology.
>>>>>
>>>>> In any case, meanwhile there more than 1000 happy users in more than
100 countries who are enjoying QO-100 using many different operating modes.
>>>>> QO-100 has stimulated a lot of technical activities in the microwave
bands and a lot of radio amateurs, who never used the microwave bands,
learned how to build and operate a station with 13cm uplink and 10 GHz
downlink.
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>
>>>>> Matthias
>>>>>
>>>>> www.dd1us.de
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
>>>>> Von: AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb-bounces@?????.???> Im Auftrag von Paul
>>>>> Stoetzer via AMSAT-BB
>>>>> Gesendet: Samstag, 20. Juni 2020 06:21
>>>>> An: Joe Leikhim <rhyolite@???????.???>
>>>>> Cc: amsat-bb@?????.???
>>>>> Betreff: Re: [amsat-bb] GeoSat OSCAR-2024 Positive comments, no,
>>>>> whining....(Was need HEO..please..)
>>>>>
>>>>> Joe,
>>>>>
>>>>> It?s important to note that QO-100 is not an amateur payload at all.
The two transponders in amateur use are on-orbit commercial spares modified
to tune to amateur frequencies. And, of course, there?s the risk that the
spares may be needed for commercial service some day.
>>>>>
>>>>> The issue is that to get an American company to do this, you need
millions of dollars up front and then probably millions of dollars a year to
support it. It?s been looked into multiple times over the years and no one
is willing to just give that away or even quote a price that?s remotely
reasonable.
>>>>>
>>>>> I do take issue with your choice of words in describing GOLF-TEE as
?baby steps.? GOLF is a project that AMSAT has committed a large amount of
money and man-hours to. It is a very significant project and will lead us
back to HEO. Our engineering team is doing tremendous work and deserves the
full support and encouragement of the amateur community. Sadly, I feel that
support is often lacking and, frankly, our volunteers deserve better than
that.
>>>>>
>>>>> If you want a HEO, support AMSAT and GOLF in any way that you can.
AMSAT is 100% committed and I am personally 100% committed to making this
happen for the community.
>>>>>
>>>>> 73,
>>>>>
>>>>> Paul Stoetzer, N8HM
>>>>> Executive Vice President
>>>>> AMSAT
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 00:01 Joe Leikhim via AMSAT-BB
>>>>> <amsat-bb@?????.???>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Robert;
>>>>>>
>>>>>> AMSAT has been in HEO before and can get there again.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The idea of my proposal is to piggy back on a willing commercial
>>>>>> satellite. The owner of that satellite would be handling the
>>>>>> necessary regulatory issues/problems. This idea has been proposed
>>>>>> before but convincing a commercial satellite owner to attach
>>>>>> unproven payload has always been an negative argument. No longer,
>>>>>> because OSCAR-100 is proven hardware and it should be considered.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Meanwhile GOLF-TEE can continue to take baby steps.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Looking for ideas to promote this idea. Be positive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Joe Leikhim
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Leikhim and Associates
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Communications Consultants
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Oviedo, Florida
>>>>>>
>>>>>> JLeikhim@???????.???
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 407-982-0446
>>>>>>
>>>>>> WWW.LEIKHIM.COM
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum
>>>>>> available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring
membership.
>>>>>> Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do not
>>>>>> reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA.
>>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
>>>>>> Subscription settings:
>>>>>> https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official
views of AMSAT-NA.
>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
>>>>> Subscription settings:
>>>>> https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum
>>>>> available to all interested persons worldwide without requiring
>>>>> membership. Opinions expressed are solely those of the author, and do
not reflect the official views of AMSAT-NA.
>>>>> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
program!
>>>>> Subscription settings:
>>>>> https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Subject: Digest Footer
_______________________________________________
Sent via amsat-bb@?????.???.
AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide
without requiring membership. Opinions expressed
are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
Not an AMSAT member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
End of AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 15, Issue 212
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