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CX2SA > SATDIG 18.07.20 02:48l 841 Lines 27524 Bytes #999 (0) @ WW
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Subj: AMSAT-BB-digest V15 274
Path: IW8PGT<IZ3LSV<IR1UAW<IK1NHL<CX2SA
Sent: 200718/0045Z @:CX2SA.SAL.URY.SOAM #:35179 [Salto] FBB7.00e $:AMSATBB15274
From: CX2SA@CX2SA.SAL.URY.SOAM
To : SATDIG@WW
Today's Topics:
1. Re: request detailed system diagram for remoting a satellite
station (Ev Tupis)
2. Re: Members Please Read (Bruce Perens)
3. Re: FW: Oscar Sub Band Freq Infio (Paul Stoetzer)
4. Re: Members Please Read (GEO Badger)
5. Re: Websites Down ? amsat.org and parens.com (saguaroastro)
6. Re: Members Please Read (Robert Bankston)
7. Re: Members Please Read (Chad KG0MW)
8. Leveraging Satnogs recordings ( was: request detailed system
diagram for remoting a satellite station) (Douglas Quagliana)
9. Re: Members Please Read (Rich Gopstein)
10. Re: Members Please Read (Bruce Perens)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2020 23:10:58 +0000 (UTC)
From: Ev Tupis <w2ev@?????.???>
To: "amsat-bb@?????.???? <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] request detailed system diagram for remoting a
satellite station
Message-ID: <358862868.2420063.1595027458755@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
I echo your approach, Curt.
I'm primarily a terrestrial narrowband operator.? No beams.? 8x halos on 2
meters.? 4x halos on 6 meters.? No rotators, no complexity.? However...I
live in a rural area with very little band noise.
My suburban brothers need beams to null out broadband noise sources,
birdies, etc.
Ev, W2EV
On Friday, July 17, 2020, 6:57:58 PM EDT, Curt Laumann via AMSAT-BB
<amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
Hi Dave,
We have a similar situation at the University of Arizona: we are also
moving towards remote control.? Even before the campus virus shutdown
elevated the priority of? remote operation, I concluded that a directional
satellite system is not optimal for K7UAZ -- given the consistent scarcity
of volunteer labor available to maintain a directional antenna system.
This fall K7UAZ will be migrating to a set of omni, circularly polarized
antennas with preamplifiers.? Not that controlling az/el rotors is overly
complicated, but this change does help make remote operation even easier.
Regards,
Curt / K7ZOO
K7UAZ Station Manager
On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 12:09 PM David J. Schmocker via AMSAT-BB <
amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Does anyone have a detailed system diagram (or interconnect drawing)
> showing how they have remoted a satellite station please?? Specifically
> which parts of the system require IP-addressable power on/off, etc.
>
>
> I am in the process of constructing a new satellite station for U/V
> linear use at Milwaukee Area Technical College (where I teach).? Our
> Data Communication and Networking class introduces satellite technology
> which I plan to demonstrate live.
>
> Because the hours of access to the building are limited, and because we
> teach Data Communication and Networking from two campuses (but have
> Satellite station at only one), remoting this station would be desirable.
>
> I have an APC IP-addressable power strip (117vac) and some power relays
> if we need 220vac switched, an IC-9700, two high-power switchable LNAs
> (2m and 70cm), antennas (20 element RHCP for 2m and 16 Turn G3RUH Helix
> for 70cm), and a Yaesu 5500 rotor with Green Heron Az/El controller
> (I'll bring Heliax from home to get to the rooftop).? Hopefully our
> city campus location is not overly noisy.? ? ? I plan to construct the
> HEO-ready station as soon as I can be back on campus to do this.
>
> One specific area of concern: how to pass audio over internet. I've
> heard Skype and some other vehicles have problematic latency but I have
> yet to remote any station to use 'near real-time audio' for CW or SSB
> QSOs so I lack experience with this.? The satellite computer
> (controlling antennas and managing Doppler) is a Mac mini running
> MacLoggerDX and MacDoppler software.
>
> If helpful, I have two surplus new Raspberry Pi 3s (new and unused) that
> could be repurposed for part of this if helpful.
>
> You'll be happy to know I've been reading the mail and I know to first
> listen and test so we Tx with minimum power.? But as a satellite newby,
> I'm sure I'll need abundant guidance when we get QRV.
>
> Any detailed system diagrams (could be off-list directly to me) showing
> how you built and configured such a remote station satellite system
> would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thank you
>
> very 73,
>
> Dave KJ9I
> KD9BOG (at work)
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
> expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed
are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2020 16:18:15 -0700
From: Bruce Perens <bruce@??????.???>
To: Fernando Ramirez <framirezferrer@?????.???>
Cc: AMSAT -BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Members Please Read
Message-ID:
<CAK2MWOu28uGPjf9=0CME6i=dxmQevXKSsmRHnKJtiyZGmhZSug@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 4:13 PM Fernando Ramirez via AMSAT-BB <
amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
> So, there's a separate funding source for legal services?
I'd be astonished.
No, this came out of one bank account where your membership dues and
donations went, along with any other money the organization happened to
make.
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2020 19:21:47 -0400
From: Paul Stoetzer <n8hm@????.???>
To: KA9QJG <KA9QJG@???????.???>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] FW: Oscar Sub Band Freq Infio
Message-ID:
<CABzOSOqSt3DDrE0nkS1f4zy5b2o2PCFfc+GqOQ2xGgkgvQv5mg@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
I believe this was proposed as a new subband for satellites 30 or more
years ago, but it was never adopted by the IARU.
The amateur satellite service is legally authorized from 144 MHz - 146
MHz and there are a few below 145.8 MHz (XW-2A, 2B, 2C, and
LilacSat-2), but 144.000 MHz - 144.025 MHz and 145.800 MHz - 146.000
MHz are the only portions of 2m that are allocated in the IARU
bandplans to amateur satellites.
73,
Paul Stoetzer, N8HM
Executive Vice President
AMSAT
On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 7:16 PM KA9QJG via AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
wrote:
>
> Not Sure this Went out
>
> 73 Don KA9QJG
>
>
>
> From: KA9QJG [mailto:KA9QJG@???????.????
> Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 4:30 PM
> To: 'AMSAT-BB@?????.????
> Subject: Oscar Sub Band Freq Infio
>
>
>
> Hello from Don KA9QJG Ham for over 40 yrs. Hope Everyone is staying Safe
> and Healthy.. I hope its ok to change the ongoing thread.. I have heard
> some New Hams using the Oscar sub bands for FM Simplex. Below Is the ARRL
> Band Chart Now Reads New
>
>
>
>
> 144.30-144.50
>
> New OSCAR subband
>
>
>
>
> 145.80-146.00
>
> OSCAR subband
>
>
>
> They are using Freq 144.315 FM Simplex. One was telling a story over 25 yrs
> ago they were using this Freq and a complaint was made to the FCC He got a
> Letter from the FCC . And He called respond the complaint and told the FCC
> that this was the Old Oscar Sub band that had not been used since the
> sixties Sats were Not up and working anymore. And the FCC Said do not
> worry about the complaint. So after listening to all this on 144.315 over
> a long time I thought the best place to get a real answer would be here.
>
>
>
> Thanks everyone Please Stay Safe and Healthy
>
> 73 At 73 Be careful Old Age is catching LOL
>
>
>
> Don KA9QJG
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 2 Meters (144-148 MHz)
>
>
> 144.00-144.05
>
> EME (CW)
>
>
> 144.05-144.10
>
> General CW and weak signals
>
>
> 144.10-144.20
>
> EME and weak-signal SSB
>
>
> 144.200
>
> National calling frequency
>
>
> 144.200-144.275
>
> General SSB operation
>
>
> 144.275-144.300
>
> Propagation beacons
>
>
> 144.30-144.50
>
> New OSCAR subband
>
>
> 144.50-144.60
>
> Linear translator inputs
>
>
> 144.60-144.90
>
> FM repeater inputs
>
>
> 144.90-145.10
>
> Weak signal and FM simplex (145.01,03,05,07,09 are widely used for packet)
>
>
> 145.10-145.20
>
> Linear translator outputs
>
>
> 145.20-145.50
>
> FM repeater outputs
>
>
> 145.50-145.80
>
> Miscellaneous and experimental modes
>
>
> 145.80-146.00
>
> OSCAR subband
>
>
> 146.01-146.37
>
> Repeater inputs
>
>
> 146.40-146.58
>
> Simplex
>
>
> 146.52
>
> National Simplex Calling Frequency
>
>
> 146.61-146.97
>
> Repeater outputs
>
>
> 147.00-147.39
>
> Repeater outputs
>
>
> 147.42-147.57
>
> Simplex
>
>
> 147.60-147.99
>
> Repeater inputs
>
> Notes: The frequency 146.40 MHz is used in some areas as a repeater input.
> This band plan has been proposed by the ARRL VHF-UHF Advisory Committee.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2020 23:28:35 +0000 (UTC)
From: GEO Badger <w3ab@?????.???>
To: Chad KG0MW <chad.kg0mw@?????.???>, AMSAT -BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Members Please Read
Message-ID: <348169440.3450098.1595028515858@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
You know, maybe the treasurer will come up on the air and put an end to all
this conjecture.
This is getting tiring.
---?
Ciao baby, catch you on the flip side??
73 de W3AB/GEO ???
http://www.w3ab.org
You can say "over", you can say "out", you just can't say "over and out".
On Friday, July 17, 2020, 04:13:55 PM PDT, Fernando Ramirez via AMSAT-BB
<amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
So, there's a separate funding source for legal services? The point is that
regardless of where it came from, AMSAT paid for it. And it was a wasteful
use of the organization's resources.
KF7R
On Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 3:06 PM Chad KG0MW via AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
wrote:
> I like watermelons. The board even has stated that the legal funds DID NOT
> come from memberships dues.
>
>
>
> ?On 7/17/20, 3:52 PM, "AMSAT-BB on behalf of Clint Bradford via AMSAT-BB" <
> amsat-bb-bounces@?????.??? on behalf of AMSAT-BB@?????.???> wrote:
>
>? ? Why are you comparing the legal expenditures with membership fees?
>
>? ? Di you discover that membership fees were used in any manner for those
> expenses?
>
>? ? If not, then why don?t we compare that amount with, say, Apples or
> Watermelons?
>
>
>
>
>
>? ? > On Jul 17, 2020, at 12:46 PM, amsat-bb-request@?????.??? wrote:
>? ? >
>? ? >>? Now we learn that the expenditure is over 16k. That is 363
> memberships, if this retired engineer's math is correct.
>
>? ? _______________________________________________
>? ? Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
>? ? to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership.
> Opinions expressed
>? ? are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views
> of AMSAT-NA.
>? ? Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite
> program!
>? ? Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
> _______________________________________________
> Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
> expressed
> are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
> AMSAT-NA.
> Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
> Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
>
_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed
are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2020 16:52:24 -0700
From: saguaroastro <saguaroastro@???.???>
To: Robert MacHale <robert.machale@?????.???>, AMSAT BB
<amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Websites Down ? amsat.org and parens.com
Message-ID: <20200718000748.22F7C877E@??????????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
I had trouble getting in on my work computer around 2100ut. I could get in
on my phone & laptop, though.73Rick Tejera (K7TEJ)Saguaro Astronomy
ClubWww.saguaroastro.orgThunderbird Astronomy ClubWww.w7tbc.org
-------- Original message --------From: Robert MacHale via AMSAT-BB
<amsat-bb@?????.???> Date: 7/17/20 15:16 (GMT-07:00) To: AMSAT BB
<amsat-bb@?????.???> Subject: [amsat-bb] Websites Down ? amsat.org and
parens.com Am I the only one having trouble accessing these websites?If this
is an attack against either group - I strongly disapprove of this type of
hacking.Bruce - is everything okay?Robert MacHale. KE6BLR Ham Radio
License.?http://www.aprsat.com/predict.?http://www.spaceCommunicator.club?.
Supporting Boy Scout Merit Badges in Radio, Robotics, and Space
Exploration_______________________________________________Sent via
AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum availableto all
interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressedare solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official
views of AMSAT-NA.Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur
satellite program!Subscription settings:
https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/ams
at-bb
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2020 00:06:00 +0000 (UTC)
From: Robert Bankston <ke4al@?????.???>
To: Chad KG0MW <chad.kg0mw@?????.???>, AMSAT -BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>,
Fernando Ramirez <framirezferrer@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Members Please Read
Message-ID: <36669289.3470373.1595030760700@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
In response to the OP <Why are you comparing the legal expenditures with
membership fees?>
The simple answer is THEY are trying to evoke anger in the electorate, so
THEY can take control of AMSAT.
Go back and read the intitial allegations in Michelle's and Patrick's
"election edition" director reports.? See how their lines of attack change
each time the true facts are revealed.? Their storyline has transformed from
illegal expenditures to unwise expenditures.
Now go back and read AMSAT's explanation of legal expenses.? You will see
that there were legitimate legal questions before the Board - question that
were not sought by the AMSAT, but, either a necessary part of their mission
or forced upon them by their accusers.? Having to expend scarce recources on
legal counsel is unfortunate, but a necessary part of entering into
contractual obligations and providing a safe workplace for your volunteers.
Robert, KE4AL
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2020 00:14:43 +0000
From: Chad KG0MW <chad.kg0mw@?????.???>
To: Bruce Perens <bruce@??????.???>, Clint Bradford
<clintbradford@???.???>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Members Please Read
Message-ID:
<CH2PR12MB3893D1FF0AD33F3AAC37D242A97D0@?????????????.????????.????.???????.??
?>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
What is concerning is funds had to be used to potentially protect the
organization. Attacks against AMSAT? Really? Come on. Let?s get back to
business.
Chad Phillips
Chad Phillips Photography
& School Photography by Mark
605.336.0777
________________________________
From: AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb-bounces@?????.???> on behalf of Bruce Perens via
AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 4:52:41 PM
To: Clint Bradford <clintbradford@???.???>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Members Please Read
On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 1:46 PM Clint Bradford via AMSAT-BB <
amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
> Why are you comparing the legal expenditures with membership fees?
It all goes in the same bank account. It might be that Yasme Foundation,
the ARRL Foundation, or ARDC inadvertently gave the money for this. They
would be upset if they did. In which case that might provide one reason
that their latest grants are to ORI.
So, we might say it's some hundreds of memberships, or 1/2 Yasme grant or 8
ARRL Foundation grants, or 150 President's Circle Basic contributions or a
piece of our US Government forgivable loan.
But it's all the same money, in the same bank account. We can't really wave
hands about whether it is memberships, donations, or grants, or the
loan to *paper
over the impact of this money being spent unwisely.*
_______________________________________________
Sent via AMSAT-BB@?????.???. AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available
to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
expressed
are solely those of the author, and do not reflect the official views of
AMSAT-NA.
Not an AMSAT-NA member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
Subscription settings: https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2020 19:18:57 -0500
From: Douglas Quagliana <dquagliana@?????.???>
To: peter@??????.???? "Peter Goodhall (2M0SQL)" <peter@????????.??.??>
Cc: AMSAT BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: [amsat-bb] Leveraging Satnogs recordings ( was: request
detailed system diagram for remoting a satellite station)
Message-ID:
<CALaYSmkSc6YKtfndnA8mdX1_kDfBhBu7hwQ1mMAqwqTSiehhsg@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 4:49 PM Peter Goodhall (2M0SQL) via AMSAT-BB <
amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
> Sadly Satnogs isn't suitable for the job being it's for telemetry only,
> also I don't believe it forwards telemetry to AMSAT-NA or AMSAT-UK so radio
> amateurs would be better off with a different solution.
>
Friends,
Satnogs is an incredible and incredibly underutilized resource for AMSAT.
It doesn't automatically forward telemetry, but you can go to the
appropriate Satnogs site, filter on the satellite you want and download the
audio recording of the pass (or passes) that you want. Then
lather-rinse-repeat for as many passes as you want. I would never have been
able to create as many recordings myself at my home QTH as I can get by
downloading them from Satnogs. You can get recordings from anywhere on the
planet where there was a ground station that made a recording. (If you're
fully onboard you could even schedule somebody else to make a recording for
you on a particular date/time in the future. Think about that.)
A while back I downloaded several months worth of old Falconsat-3 audio
recordings so that I could run the recordings through my own 9600 DSP
demodulator and see if I could recover any data from the recordings, and
improve the demodulator as much as possible. I wrote some scripts to
convert and filter each ogg recording and then run them all through my
demodulator. This whole scheme actually worked too well, as I now have
more than enough recordings to keep me busy for a long long time because it
takes my old computer DAYS to process through ALL of those recordings
[footnote 1] and to decide if the latest tweak was an improvement or not.
(Think about your last visit to the eye doctor where you watch the eye
chart through the phoropter [footnote 2] while the eye doctor makes
adjustments to the lenses and asks you if this one is now "Better? Or
worse?" -- well, this is almost the same thing but it takes three days to
find out the answer for each change. But, I digress...)
So far, of the recordings that I downloaded, the most extreme pass is
https://network.satnogs.org/observations/180707/
the audio recording is eighteen megabytes and is online at
https://ia902808.us.archive.org/7/items/satnogs-observation-180707/satnogs_180
707_2018-07-12T00-08-11.ogg
The satnogs webpage for this pass shows 644 valid 9600 baud AX.25 packets
this recording so you know it is a good pass with plenty of frames in it.
By throwing everything I can think of at this recording, I can now get over
1000 good frames out of it. Oh, and, hey, if anybody else tries this
recording against their own demodulator, then whatever results you get
please send them to me so I can look for any valid frames I am missing.
And the advantage of the satnogs recordings is that you can keep tweaking
your software iteratively by running the recordings against the "new"
demodulator again, and again, and again, and compare the results. You
could never achieve this or iterate this many times with live satellite
passes.
73,
Douglas KA2UPW/5
[1] If the whole process doesn't get interrupted... Actually, this says
more about my old slow computer than it says about the speed of the
demodulator.
[2] If you get your eyes checked then you know this device. You just might
not know the name for it. Consider "phoropter" to be today's new
word-of-the-day. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoropter
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2020 20:23:15 -0400
From: Rich Gopstein <rich@????????????.???>
To: GEO Badger <w3ab@?????.???>
Cc: AMSAT -BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Members Please Read
Message-ID:
<CANsNeaqoDw7C4LF=SX51px_QmFp_ZZqjs1XABiZegzJ6Hy0-9A@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
I'm not sure what the issue is. If the organization was concerned about a
legal issue, they should reach out to their lawyers - it's their
responsibility to protect AMSAT. Lawyers cost money. Trying to track
which individual dollars were used doesn't sound like a productive effort.
Rich, KD2CQ
On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 8:15 PM GEO Badger via AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
wrote:
> You know, maybe the treasurer will come up on the air and put an end to
> all this conjecture.
>
> This is getting tiring.
>
> ---
> Ciao baby, catch you on the flip side
> 73 de W3AB/GEO
>
> http://www.w3ab.org
>
> You can say "over", you can say "out", you just can't say "over and out".
>
> On Friday, July 17, 2020, 04:13:55 PM PDT, Fernando Ramirez via
> AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???> wrote:
>
> So, there's a separate funding source for legal services? The point is
> that
> regardless of where it came from, AMSAT paid for it. And it was a wasteful
> use of the organization's resources.
>
> KF7R
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 17, 2020, 3:06 PM Chad KG0MW via AMSAT-BB <amsat-bb@?????.???>
> wrote:
>
> > I like watermelons. The board even has stated that the legal funds DID
> NOT
> > come from memberships dues.
> >
> >
> >
> > ?On 7/17/20, 3:52 PM, "AMSAT-BB on behalf of Clint Bradford via
> AMSAT-BB" <
> > amsat-bb-bounces@?????.??? on behalf of AMSAT-BB@?????.???> wrote:
> >
> > Why are you comparing the legal expenditures with membership fees?
> >
> > Di you discover that membership fees were used in any manner for those
> > expenses?
> >
> > If not, then why don?t we compare that amount with, say, Apples or
> > Watermelons?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > On Jul 17, 2020, at 12:46 PM, amsat-bb-request@?????.??? wrote:
> > >
> > >> Now we learn that the expenditure is over 16k. That is 363
> > memberships, if this retired engineer's math is correct.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> to all interested persons worldwide without requiring membership. Opinions
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------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Fri, 17 Jul 2020 17:26:55 -0700
From: Bruce Perens <bruce@??????.???>
To: Chad KG0MW <chad.kg0mw@?????.???>
Cc: Clint Bradford <clintbradford@???.???>, AMSAT BB
<amsat-bb@?????.???>
Subject: Re: [amsat-bb] Members Please Read
Message-ID:
<CAK2MWOuq2yZYybuycV1TOY8uwp41be_FdQPya4O3n3vUVcTLXQ@????.?????.???>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 5:14 PM Chad KG0MW <chad.kg0mw@?????.???> wrote:
> Attacks against AMSAT? Really?
>
This is exactly the kind of thinking that got AMSAT in trouble.
There were never any "attacks" against AMSAT. There was never an enemy.
There was never a good side and a bad side.
There was opposition. And there still is today. The opposition are members,
and they believe that the current board members are doing a bad job of
running AMSAT.
Democracy always includes opposition, and it isn't democracy without it.
Treating them as the enemy is the problem.
Thanks
Bruce
------------------------------
Subject: Digest Footer
_______________________________________________
Sent via amsat-bb@?????.???.
AMSAT-NA makes this open forum available to all interested persons worldwide
without requiring membership. Opinions expressed
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AMSAT-NA.
Not an AMSAT member? Join now to support the amateur satellite program!
https://www.amsat.org/mailman/listinfo/amsat-bb
------------------------------
End of AMSAT-BB Digest, Vol 15, Issue 274
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